View Full Version : Neocons Lay Siege to the Ivory Towers
doc_simon
May 5, 2005, 01:11 PM
Hopefully no one has posted this before, but just came across this article at the LA Times (http://www.latimes.com/news/printedition/opinion/la-oe-makdisi4may04,1,1436422.story?coll=la-home-home&ctrack=1&cset=true) . Is the US really this mad? It's difficult to tell from this side of the pond.
In the months ahead, the state Senate Committee on Education will consider a bill that pretends to strike a blow for intellectual honesty, truth and freedom, but in reality poses a profound threat to academic freedom in the United States.
[...]
The real purpose of the bill, then, is not to provide students with "rights" but to institute state monitoring of universities, to impose specific points of view on instructors — in many cases, points of view that have been intellectually discredited — and ultimately to silence dissenting voices by punishing universities that protect them.
[...]
Backers of the Florida bill would like to empower students to sue professors with whom they disagree on the theory of evolution.
Urvogel Reverie
May 5, 2005, 01:16 PM
Is the US really this mad? It's difficult to tell from this side of the pond.
Yes, it is. Can the civilized amongst us join you over there?
Urvogel
LambdaCalculator
May 5, 2005, 01:18 PM
Yes, it is. Can the civilized amongst us join you over there?
Urvogel
I second this question.
Albion
May 5, 2005, 01:34 PM
There was a similar case in Florida that was discussed here a little while ago; the guy who introduced the bill specifically singled out evolution and intelligent design as examples where a student should be able to sue the college if a professor refuses to allow alternatives into the discussion.
doc_simon
May 5, 2005, 01:37 PM
Yes, it is. Can the civilized amongst us join you over there?
Sure, there's always room for one more.
Am worried now - as I'm spending the summer in your country :eek:
Autonemesis
May 5, 2005, 01:40 PM
"Why should we, as fairly moderate to conservative legislators, continue to support universities that turn out students who rail against the very policies their parents voted us in for?" asks the Republican sponsor of the Ohio version of the bill.
There can hardly be imagined a more apt encapsulation of what this is all about, than this quote right here. Universities, as government-supported indoctrination centers, must only indoctrinate students in government-approved ideologies.
The bill is being pushed in a number of states by David Horowitz (http://www.frontpagemag.com/index.asp), a former radical leftist (Black Panthers in the 1960s) turned radical rightist (he makes the John Birch Society look pinko) in the 2000s. There's a similar bill in Ohio and I don't know where all else.
RBH
Frito
May 5, 2005, 03:08 PM
See the problem is that the facts have a liberal slant...
Global warming, evolution, gay parenting... where is the equal time for the conservative facts.
These people need to learn that fair is not equal. Being fair is paying attention to actual facts and by actually doing research rather than, you know, trying to push through crackpot theories by claiming that they are under represented.
CFDL
May 5, 2005, 04:10 PM
Amazingly I think Florida isn't insane enough to pass the Academic Freedom Bill.
Even governor Jeb Bush can't bring himself to support the bill. I believe one problem is that Baxley(the guy who introduced the bill) and Horowitz sound so much like outrageous stereotypes that some conservatives feel uncomfortable supporting them.
Horowitz defending bill at a FL house meeting (http://www.alligator.org/pt2/050406baxley.php)
"Universities are already massively interfered with by the government," Horowitz said. "You will admit students with this skin color with these grades, but not that kind of student with those grades. No one who objects to this bill has objections to those laws, and that's hypocrisy."
The irony. Florida eliminated race baced admissions 5 years ago.
show_no_mercy
May 5, 2005, 07:03 PM
Oh yeah, I already posted a similar story:
http://www.iidb.org/vbb/showthread.php?t=119863
Oh yeah, I already posted a similar story:
http://www.iidb.org/vbb/showthread.php?t=119863Shucks. I shoulda seen that -- I searched CSS on "Horowitz" and missed it.
RBH
show_no_mercy
May 5, 2005, 07:34 PM
Shucks. I shoulda seen that -- I searched CSS on "Horowitz" and missed it.
RBH
Does this mean I have some hidden mod powers that are beginning to awaken?
Donkey_Popsicle
May 5, 2005, 07:36 PM
If education is run by the government then it's bound to get political, which is to say, completely idiotic.
Does this mean I have some hidden mod powers that are beginning to awaken?No, it means that my hidden powers are so well hidden as to be invisible. :(
RBH
Jesus Tap-Dancin' Christ
May 5, 2005, 08:01 PM
Academic Freedom Bill lets students sue for teachers excersizing their acedemic freedom?
Why not call the enforcing bureua Ministry of Truth?
thexrated
May 5, 2005, 08:06 PM
Academic Freedom Bill lets students sue for teachers excersizing their acedemic freedom?
Why not call the enforcing bureua Ministry of Truth?
And rename Homeland Security to Nightwatch.
Autonemesis
May 5, 2005, 08:09 PM
If education is run by the government then it's bound to get political, which is to say, completely idiotic.
Every activity involving two or more people is political.
Cynner
May 5, 2005, 08:14 PM
This is a doubleplusgood idea. I am reporting the rest of you.
~1325-455-A8896
Stella
May 5, 2005, 08:31 PM
Sure, there's always room for one more.
Am worried now - as I'm spending the summer in your country :eek:
Get out you dirty terrorist job stealing foreigner!!
(and pack me in your suitcase before you go!)
Just stick to the coasts and cities north of the mason dixon line. You'll be fiine. =)
And don't stand idly with your suitcase near any national monuments. Unless you like getting tackled by masked men, that is.
NonHomogenized
May 6, 2005, 10:06 AM
And rename Homeland Security to Nightwatch.
Actually, I think "Department of Homeland Security" is just fine a name. At most, we could change it to "Ministry of Homeland Security"
Oikoman
May 6, 2005, 10:27 AM
If education is run by the government then it's bound to get political, which is to say, completely idiotic.
Whats the alternative... homeschooling through your Masters degree? :rolling:
Seriously, there is nothing the neocons would love more than to defund the state colleges and universities, forcing most people to enter the work force with a highschool diploma and the funneling the rest into private religious colleges like Bob Jones.
Urvogel Reverie
May 6, 2005, 01:15 PM
Sure, there's always room for one more.
Am worried now - as I'm spending the summer in your country :eek:
Don't.
Jack the Bodiless
May 6, 2005, 01:27 PM
If a bill like this DOES get through somewhere, then we need to move fast.
Before the cretinists get an evolution case underway, a student should adopt the flat-Earth position and start legal action against teaching round-Earthism in geography.
Avatar
May 6, 2005, 03:21 PM
It's looking as though the bill is dying rapidly everywhere. If anyone knows anything different please let me know.
The Ohio version, S.B. 24, was introduced in January of this year and was referred to the Education Committee, where (AFAIK) it has languished. I'll try to find out more.
RBH
ETA: According to the legislation status report, it has not yet been considered by the committee, it's not (yet) on the committee's calendar so no committee report has been issued by the committee, and it has not been introduced in the House. Meanhile, other bills introduced at the same time have gone all the way to signing by the governor. Looks like it's dying a slow unlamented death in committee.
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