What parts of the Bible are worth keeping?

[kaelcarp]

Looking at the Bible strictly as a tool for teaching moral lessons, not as a religious text, which parts do you think still retain value? Which parts absolutely need to go?

I'm not exactly what you'd call a big Bible scholar. I haven't really opened up the ol' book for a good read since I was a kid and believed in it, but from what I remember, there are actually some decent non-religious moral lessons in it, stories like the Good Samaritan, some of the Proverbs, etc. Even the Adam & Eve story has some value if you take it as a statement about how the more you learn about the world (eat from the tree of knowledge), the less like a paradise it is.

I'd get rid of stuff like Job, which is a terrible lesson IMO, and all the ridiculous rules laid out in places like Leviticus (I think that's the book I'm thinking of).

I'm not looking for "throw the whole thing out it's not worth it" type answers, but real, thoughtful responses. Anyone?

[Alethias]

The parts that spell out commonsense morals.

In other words, the only parts that are worth keeping are the parts with stuff that reasonable people can figure out on their own without needing the bible. For example....that it's wrong to murder or steal...most murderers and thiefs know that what they are doing is wrong, but they do it anyway.

If your goal was to induce dependancy on a false authority, I would pretty much leave it alone. It does a better job at that than anything i could create.

[Mageth]

You can cut out that little ribbon and use it as a bookmark in other books. ;)

I like Job, BTW. It's an excellent illustration of the frustrations and dangers of dealing with a precocious and self-absorbed deity.

[kaelcarp]

You can cut out that little ribbon and use it as a bookmark in other books. ;)

I like Job, BTW. It's an excellent illustration of the frustrations and dangers of dealing with a precocious and self-absorbed deity.
I guess if you take it for the opposite of its apparently intended lesson, it works well. It can even be an illustration of how easily abused faith is. But Job getting rewarded in the end kind of ruins that.

[Aravnah Ornan]

You can cut out that little ribbon and use it as a bookmark in other books. ;)The pages make good rolling paper, or so I've been told. :angel:

There are plenty of good things in Ecclesiastes. There are also some good moral teachings in Proverbs and the Gospels (particularly the parables that the fundies don't quote), and little bits and pieces scattered through the OT prophets.

The OT historical books can definitely go, as can the NT from Acts on.

[seebs]

Hmm. I'd keep the Gospels as a whole, because I think the whole things give continuity.

Paul's letters are rougher; I think that they are actually good, but the writing is so hard to follow that it's easy to derive false beliefs from them.

The prophets are another mixed bag.

MHO? It's okay as it is, as long as you understand that it is a book about the human search for God, not a book God wrote.

Throwing out parts of it is uncomfortably close to denying that humans ever practiced slavery or genocide, so we can feel all clean. The historical fact of human evil is a crucial moral lesson in itself.

[Son of James]

Looking at the Bible strictly as a tool for teaching moral lessons, not as a religious text, which parts do you think still retain value? Which parts absolutely need to go?




Been done...

http://www.angelfire.com/co/JeffersonBible/

[kaelcarp]

Been done...

http://www.angelfire.com/co/JeffersonBible/
Thanks for the link. I'd heard about Jefferson doing this, but I didn't realize there were actual surviving versions of it.

[Nay-Sayer]

Looking at the Bible strictly as a tool for teaching moral lessons, not as a religious text, which parts do you think still retain value? Which parts absolutely need to go?

The only part of the Bible worth retaining is the teachings of Jesus, IMO. Especially the so-called B-Attitudes. The whole of the rest of the book isn't fit to be toilet paper.....

[Son of James]

Thanks for the link. I'd heard about Jefferson doing this, but I didn't realize there were actual surviving versions of it.

Your welcome. If that version was used I think the west would be a much happier place !

[Kassiana]

I think that unfortunately the mountains of bad so overshadow the few grains of good in the Bible that none of it can or should be salvaged. Throw the whole thing out, unless you're teaching people how ancient barbarians rationalized their genocides.

[Mageth]

Maybe you could make a nice billfold out of the leather cover.

I've also heard that cutting out the center of a bible makes a decent place to hide your "stash" or other goodies.

[steamer]

I guess if you take it for the opposite of its apparently intended lesson, it works well. It can even be an illustration of how easily abused faith is. But Job getting rewarded in the end kind of ruins that.

I like the way his first set of sons were rewarded :devil3:

[braces_for_impact]

Genesis 1
1:1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

Revelation 22
22:21 The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you all. Amen.

All the rest is merely filler. :p

[CowboyHeretic]

Toss Paul's epistles. Keep everything else.

[seebs]

Toss Paul's epistles. Keep everything else.

I am not sure I agree with this. Can you suggest a good replacement for 1 Corinthians 13? Doesn't Romans 8:35-39 give a rather central message that would probably make a lot of people a lot calmer if they believed it?

The problem is not that Paul's nasty, it's that he's hard to read; he says some really good stuff that is not duplicated elsewhere.

[Godless Wonder]

The only part of the Bible worth retaining is the teachings of Jesus, IMO. Especially the so-called B-Attitudes. The whole of the rest of the book isn't fit to be toilet paper.....
Jesus is way way way overrated. He teaches the doctrine of "everlasting punishment" for example. (end of Matt 25).

[CowboyHeretic]

I am not sure I agree with this. Can you suggest a good replacement for 1 Corinthians 13? Doesn't Romans 8:35-39 give a rather central message that would probably make a lot of people a lot calmer if they believed it?

The problem is not that Paul's nasty, it's that he's hard to read; he says some really good stuff that is not duplicated elsewhere.

I'm not saying that there isn't some truth to be found here BUT Paul was incongruent too many times for my taste. I'm an Isaiah 28 beliver, Line upon Line, Precept upon Precept. The fcat that Paul is not duplicated elsewhere is my entire argumnet against him. Peter and James the brother of Jesus didn't even like Paul.
The epistles were simply a compilation of letters to the various churches of the day, that's like my preacher sending a letter to your preacher. Paul's teachings were too accomodating to the pagans and lead to the pollution of Mainstream Christianity via pagan Rome. That's what MOST of the anti-christians here are railing against. The dogma of the church has let them down.

[Columbus]

Toss Paul's epistles. Keep everything else.I would toss Paul's epistles where they contradict Jesus' Teachings as far as moral teachings go. Original Testament also. But tossing anything without becoming familiar with what it says is to choose ignorance about how modern Christian culture got the way it is. The problem with choosing Bible Illiteracy is that we live in a culture shaped by the Bible, or at least the pretense of Scripturality. You will be much less effective at re-shaping the culture if you don't understand the words that were so formative. This culture could use some re-shaping.

Tom

[southernhybrid]

I'd keep these lines. Judge not that ye be not judged! The truth shall set you free! Love ye one another.


I guess the Sermon on the Mt. and the parts of the Gospel where Jesus seems to be supporting the concept of separation of church and state are pretty useful too. Not much in the OT worth salvaging imo. Perhaps a little poetry, but surely there is better poetry in other places. Most of the Pauline stuff really sucks. I don't find much of the Bible to be especially unique. Better advice can be found in many other philosophies and religions imnsho.

Sorry to be so KJV. I was indoctrinated in a fundy church that only used the KJV.

[capsaicin67]

Keep it as is. The thickness and weight of a proper, large one is excellent for pressing leaves and photos etc.

And perfect for when the Religious Beast's Stormtroopers do house to house searches in the future to do loyalty checks. Like Mein Kampf in WW2 Germany, it will be a most useful acccessory for the high visibility coffee table.

[Eldarion Lathria]

Keep the softcore porn. The rest is pernicious or redundant.

Eldarion Lathria

[jonesg]

Looking at the Bible strictly as a tool for teaching moral lessons, not as a religious text, which parts do you think still retain value? Which parts absolutely need to go?

I'm not exactly what you'd call a big Bible scholar. I haven't really opened up the ol' book for a good read since I was a kid and believed in it, but from what I remember, there are actually some decent non-religious moral lessons in it, stories like the Good Samaritan, some of the Proverbs, etc. Even the Adam & Eve story has some value if you take it as a statement about how the more you learn about the world (eat from the tree of knowledge), the less like a paradise it is.

I'd get rid of stuff like Job, which is a terrible lesson IMO, and all the ridiculous rules laid out in places like Leviticus (I think that's the book I'm thinking of).

I'm not looking for "throw the whole thing out it's not worth it" type answers, but real, thoughtful responses. Anyone?

Keep all the bits you don't comprehend, its all there in the black bits.
We call them words.

[Sparrow]

Keep all the bits you don't comprehend, its all there in the black bits.
We call them words.
So we can throw out all the red ink stuff?

[DISSIDENT AGGRESSOR]

Some Bibles do have some pretty good illustations [pictures] in them, and let's not forget the maps, if your into those kind of things, I mean...

[steamer]

I like "In the begining" as an opening to a fairy tale. "Amen" is also a good ending. The stuff in between ought to be tossed though.

[RevDahlia]

I'm partial to Ecclesiastes and the Song of Songs, and parts of Psalms.

[Angrillori]

Gotta keep Song of Songs!

Actually, I wouldn't take out a lot, I would just add a bit to the beginning:

"This is a work of fiction. Any resemblance to people, or places is purely coincidental. Yadda yadda yadda."

[Queen of Swords]

The two parables I like are the one about the woman who badgered the judge into hearing her case, IIRC, and the good samaritan. I've also been in a position where I was helped by the kindness of strangers. And there are a few good verses in Ecclesiastes. The rest of it has a date with the paper shredder.

[Kilgore Trout]

I like the parable about the fool who comes into town, speaks against god's laws, and says everybody is gonna die in their sins unless they kiss his ass. Then the people crucify him because he's obviously a false prophet. Then he rises from the dead and appears to the people who already believe in him, but not to the people that were skeptical of him. It's a great lesson.

Too bad they had to be so reduntant and repeat it four times in the NT.

I also like the part about the twin gazelles and the mound of wheat encircled by lilies in the song of songs.:thumbs:

[kaelcarp]

Keep all the bits you don't comprehend, its all there in the black bits.
We call them words.
Are they anything like the little shapes I'm viewing now?

[AthenaAwakened]

Ecclesiastes is my favorite. And some of the verses and chapters that my gramma made me memorize when i was little are still good. But the question isn't what to throw out or what to keep. The question is, should we believe the Bible simply because it's the Bible? I think not. Like any book, there are parts you will like and parts you won't. And like any book I would say to you, take the parts you like and leave the rest.

Peace

[kaelcarp]

Ecclesiastes is my favorite. And some of the verses and chapters that my gramma made me memorize when i was little are still good. But the question isn't what to throw out or what to keep. The question is, should we believe the Bible simply because it's the Bible? I think not. Like any book, there are parts you will like and parts you won't. And like any book I would say to you, take the parts you like and leave the rest.

Peace
I don't really think of the Bible as a book to be believed or disbelieved, though I understand that's how most view it. I think that, like most religions, it's a foundation for moral living (whether or not you agree with the morals) that uses mythology and metaphor to tell people how they should live life. In my view, to view it as a literal word of God is to miss the point.

What I'm really asking here is: Which parts do you think put forth solid ideas for living life? Are there parts that detract from that and should be done away with? Are there parts that could stand alone as non-religious parables or moral lessons?

[AthenaAwakened]

The bible is a book. One of several million. You can get lessons from it as you can from any of those several million. You can use it as a door stop. Read it. then decide for yourself if any of it is worth living by.

Peace

[kaelcarp]

The bible is a book. One of several million. You can get lessons from it as you can from any of those several million. You can use it as a door stop. Read it. then decide for yourself if any of it is worth living by.

Peace
Well, sure, yeah. I have my opinions, others have theirs. I was just asking what others' opinions were.

And the Bible, whether any of us here like it or not, isn't just any old book. It's far too prominently featured in Western mythology and history for it not to be considered at least a bit more important than the vast majority of books in our society.

[Machiavelli]

I think that the the bible can be credited for large strides towards egalitarianism. The simple notion that we are all equal under gods eyes was a great equalizer. I think this is something we take for granted today that was quite revolutionary in biblical times. Though we've gone way past it now, the way that Christianity allowed people to question the establishment in biblical times seems much like what we are doing to Christianity today, questioning it's authority.

If there is anything to keep, I think it's that.

[AthenaAwakened]

Well, sure, yeah. I have my opinions, others have theirs. I was just asking what others' opinions were.

And the Bible, whether any of us here like it or not, isn't just any old book. It's far too prominently featured in Western mythology and history for it not to be considered at least a bit more important than the vast majority of books in our society.

I think that not so much the bible but people's belief in the bible has been the curx of it's power. The bible as an influrnce on history and society is indeed an important book and therefore worth of study. But that's not your question. You asked:

Looking at the Bible strictly as a tool for teaching moral lessons, not as a religious text, which parts do you think still retain value? Which parts absolutely need to go?

In an earlier post I told you my favorite parts in the bible. I find those passages speak to me. I don't know if they will speak to you. Read the book and see what resonates with you (also the the minor prophets like Amos and Obidiah. The M.L.King quote "Lets justice flow down like water and righteousness like a mighty stream," comes from Amos. For the most part these words were written from the standpoint of revolutionaries. They attack the power structure and call for the equal treatment of all, or as best they can considering their time and place)

Peace