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Shinobi
August 11, 2005, 08:19 AM
Well, I'm the guy that posted previously about the nutty religious teachers at my TAFE. One of them said that Richard Dawkins (who she hates) calls people "evil" when they don't agree with him. When she said it, I told her that the guy doesn't pull any punches when it comes to religion and she said that he calls people evil for having professional disagreements with him, religious or not.
She thinks he can't take critisism and he lashes out at anyone who questions him. I think B.S she probably got this crap from a Christian magazine with an axe to grind.

Any confirmations of this?

Oolon Colluphid
August 11, 2005, 08:28 AM
Get her to cite references. Till then, I am confident she is talking through her fundament(alism).

Dawkins has called religion evil, sure. And probably has called 'evil' some of the things people do in its name. But professional colleagues? Horseshit.

Richard Forrest
August 11, 2005, 09:06 AM
Well, I'm the guy that posted previously about the nutty religious teachers at my TAFE. One of them said that Richard Dawkins (who she hates) calls people "evil" when they don't agree with him. When she said it, I told her that the guy doesn't pull any punches when it comes to religion and she said that he calls people evil for having professional disagreements with him, religious or not.
She thinks he can't take critisism and he lashes out at anyone who questions him. I think B.S she probably got this crap from a Christian magazine with an axe to grind.

Any confirmations of this?

From an interview with Richard Dawkins:

"Q Let's take another religious word - 'evil'. Do you have a concept of evil?

A I mistrust the uses of words like 'evil' which suggest a kind of personification of them. I'm happy to use a word like 'evil' of a particular individual. I'm happy to say that 'Adolf Hitler was evil, Adolf Hitler did, did evil things', but too many people once again, leap to the conclusion 'Oh there must be some kind of spirit of evil which entered into Hitler,' or 'There's a spirit of evil abroad'. That I think is unhelpful, putting it mildly."


For his view on religion:
http://www.simonyi.ox.ac.uk/dawkins/WorldOfDawkins-archive/Dawkins/Work/Articles/1994-12religion.shtml

It doesn't suggest that he'd label a creationist as 'evil'.

From a book review by Dawkins:
"It is absolutely safe to say that if you meet somebody who claims not to believe in evolution, that person is ignorant, stupid or insane (or wicked, but I'd rather not consider that)."
http://www.simonyi.ox.ac.uk/dawkins/WorldOfDawkins-archive/Dawkins/Work/Reviews/1989-04-09review_blueprint.shtml


Richard Forrest

jonesg
August 11, 2005, 09:06 AM
Well, I'm the guy that posted previously about the nutty religious teachers at my TAFE. One of them said that Richard Dawkins (who she hates) calls people "evil" when they don't agree with him. When she said it, I told her that the guy doesn't pull any punches when it comes to religion and she said that he calls people evil for having professional disagreements with him, religious or not.
She thinks he can't take critisism and he lashes out at anyone who questions him. I think B.S she probably got this crap from a Christian magazine with an axe to grind.

Any confirmations of this?


Not true.

Hiero5ant
August 11, 2005, 10:09 AM
The statement almost certainly being referred to is this:

鈥淚t is absolutely safe to say that if you meet somebody who claims not to believe in evolution, that person is ignorant, stupid, or insane (or wicked, but I鈥檇 rather not consider that)鈥?

Which was made in a NYT book review in 1989. You'll notice that 'wicked' is only one of four disjuncts, and the disjunction itself is true. You can even verify this experimentally.

butswana
August 11, 2005, 10:21 AM
The statement almost certainly being referred to is this:

鈥淚t is absolutely safe to say that if you meet somebody who claims not to believe in evolution, that person is ignorant, stupid, or insane (or wicked, but I鈥檇 rather not consider that)鈥?

Which was made in a NYT book review in 1989. You'll notice that 'wicked' is only one of four disjuncts, and the disjunction itself is true. You can even verify this experimentally.

Sounds about right to me. Except he left out LIAR, which could be seen as "wicked", unless "wicked" means being possessed by some supernatural evil.
Is it evil to intentionally mislead people?

EricK
August 11, 2005, 12:00 PM
Sounds about right to me. Except he left out LIAR, which could be seen as "wicked", unless "wicked" means being possessed by some supernatural evil.
Is it evil to intentionally mislead people?
That is what I assumed he meant by wicked.

Eric

Sven
August 11, 2005, 12:06 PM
From a book review by Dawkins:
"It is absolutely safe to say that if you meet somebody who claims not to believe in evolution, that person is ignorant, stupid or insane (or wicked, but I'd rather not consider that)."
I wonder which of "ignorant, stupid, insane, wicked" is Kurt Wise (http://www.iidb.org/vbb/showthread.php?p=2616513#post2616513) in Dawkins opinion.

Hiero5ant
August 11, 2005, 12:16 PM
I would say that openly advocating something which you know and admit to be contradicted by all available facts is a form of wickedness.

Sven
August 11, 2005, 12:17 PM
I would say that openly advocating something which you know and admit to be contradicted by all available facts is a form of wickedness.
I'd rather choose insane. But I actually wonder about Dawkins view - did he say something explicitely on this?

Evolutionist
August 11, 2005, 08:55 PM
I wonder which of "ignorant, stupid, insane, wicked" is Kurt Wise in Dawkins opinion.

Probablyn insane- as he doesn't lead people to believing that YEC actually has a chance and he only believes it because of his interpretation of the babble.

RBH
August 11, 2005, 09:01 PM
I wonder which of "ignorant, stupid, insane, wicked" is Kurt Wise (http://www.iidb.org/vbb/showthread.php?p=2616513#post2616513) in Dawkins opinion.Sadly, an Honest Creationist (http://www.secularhumanism.org/index.php?section=library&page=dawkins_21_4).

RBH

Aegeri
August 11, 2005, 09:14 PM
I would say that openly advocating something which you know and admit to be contradicted by all available facts is a form of wickedness.
Or just blind faith would be a better description?

Wickedness I don't think would be fair here as that would imply some form of malicious/evil intent though.

wick路ed Audio pronunciation of "wickedness" ( P ) Pronunciation Key (wkd)
adj. wick路ed路er, wick路ed路est

1. Evil by nature and in practice: 鈥渢his wicked man Hitler, the repository and embodiment of many forms of soul-destroying hatred鈥? (Winston S. Churchill).
2. Playfully malicious or mischievous: a wicked prank; a critic's wicked wit.
3. Severe and distressing: a wicked cough; a wicked gash; wicked driving conditions.
4. Highly offensive; obnoxious: a wicked stench.
5. Slang. Strikingly good, effective, or skillful: a wicked curve ball; a wicked imitation.

Sven
August 12, 2005, 04:32 AM
Sadly, an Honest Creationist (http://www.secularhumanism.org/index.php?section=library&page=dawkins_21_4).

Yes, I know about this article - that's why I brought Wise up. But I'm not sure if we can determine from this article if Dawkins thinks he is "ignorant, stupid, insane, wicked".

Or just blind faith would be a better description?
Yeah, as I said: insane. :D

Oolon Colluphid
August 12, 2005, 04:37 AM
Take four parts insane and whisk in one part stupid and one part ignorant. Leave to stew, then keep away from the heat of rational discussion.

Result: a plateful of willingly deluded.