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jim alison
June 12, 2007, 05:34 AM
IN OUR EMAIL

From : Cristina
Sent : Monday, June 11, 2007 11:03 AM
To : The Constitutional Principle: Separation of Church and State
Subject : Best-selling author discusses dismantling of U.S. religious heritage in new book

Mr. Mansfield is open to debating topics covered in his new book – please let me know if there is interest.

All my best,
Cristina
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June 2007


Exactly 60 Years Ago, U.S. Supreme Court Issued Ruling (Everson V. Board Of Education)
That Effectively Destroyed Founding Fathers’ Vision For Religion In America….Says Author/Historian Stephen Mansfield in new book:

TEN TORTURED WORDS:
How the Founding Fathers Tried to Protect Religion in America….
And What’s Happened Since


“Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion” are the first ten words of the Bill of Rights, and, according to author and historian Stephen Mansfield, those words “were a miracle of history: for the first time in human experience, the legislative power of a nation was forbidden from legislating the conscious of man.”

However, in his upcoming book, TEN TORTURED WORDS: How the Founding Fathers Tried to Protect Religion in America…. And What’s Happened Since (June 5/Thomas Nelson/ ISBN-13: 978-1-5955-5084-2), Mansfield exposes how the Supreme Court has rejected the design our Founding Fathers created and set in motion the dismantling of our religious heritage.

“Religion flourished for 150 years after the Founding Fathers,” says Mansfield. “There was a national encouragement of faith, the states were allowed to nurture as vibrant a faith as the people wished. The fact that the Supreme Court was not called on to issue a ruling directly related to the separation of church and state until after World War Two shows just how solid the foundation was.”

But, according to TEN TORTURED WORDS, that ruling was a disaster. Everson v. Board of Education, which forbids the federal government from passing laws that aided religion or using any tax money to support religion or religious institutions, has dismantled the heritage our Founding Fathers created. The book shows how this single ruling has led to a culture of secularization including lawsuits to erase religious phrases and symbols from government property such as schools, land, offices, courts and even town squares, how Lyndon Johnson’s amendment to the tax code has completely silenced the political speech of religious, tax-exempt organizations, and how the ruling lead to the rise of radical organizations like The People for the American Way, American Civil Liberties Union and Americans United for the Separation of Church and State, who intimidate local governments and school officials with lawsuits, yet profit financially from their actions.

Other fascinating points in the book:

–The U. S. Constitution does not even mention the words “separation of church and state; they were not even penned until fourteen years after the First Amendment became law.

–Thomas Jefferson, supposedly a non-religious man who wanted a secular America, attended church for years in the United States capitol building.

–The First Amendment was never intended to apply to the states, only the federal government.

–The Supreme Court Justice who wrote the disastrous decision that secularized the First Amendment was a member of the KKK and was so incompetent that one of his fellow Justices suggested he go back to law school.

--Current United States law allows organizations like the ACLU to sue school districts and towns over religious symbols and then have their legal fees paid by the losers if they win the case. This means that for the ACLU, dismantling America’s religious heritage has become a profit-making venture—and all at the expense of school districts, towns and even veterans’ cemeteries.

--Stephen Mansfield writes about “Faith-Based Blackmail” in which the ACLU threatens a school district with a lawsuit and the school district caves in because they can’t afford to pay the ACLU’s legal fees if they lose. This has meant that Bible studies and even the Boy Scouts have been driven from public property without a fight—all because of the ACLU’s “Faith-Based Blackmail.”

--A number of measures are being proposed in Congress today to try to restore the Founding Fathers’ intentions for the First Amendment. One such measure, the Public Expression of Religion Act, has even passed the House of Representatives and is now working its way through the Senate.

In TEN TORTURED WORDS, Mansfield also denotes how a religious awakening is underway in America today, which is forcing a reconsideration of the role of religion in modern American society and will surely play a role in the upcoming 2008 election. “The truth is that the sixty year legacy of the Supreme Court’s Everson decision has tortured the intent of the founding generation, tortured the vital role of religion in a civil society and tortured the emergent faith that now offers an American renaissance.”

He adds, “The present American moment – when a religiously inspired global war, a religiously inspired president, an increasingly religious population and religiously inflamed politics all shape the national experience – seems a perfect moment for the reconsideration of our religious heritage and of the laws that have banished the wisdom of that heritage from our public life.”

Stephen Mansfield is The New York Times best selling author of The Faith of George W. Bush, The Faith of the American Soldier, Benedict XVI: His Life and Mission, and Never Give In: The Extraordinary Character of Winston Churchill, among other works of history, biography and contemporary culture.

# # # #

Ruiner
June 12, 2007, 06:53 AM
Oh.... My... Dog.
He adds, “The present American moment – when a religiously inspired global war, a religiously inspired president, an increasingly religious population and religiously inflamed politics all shape the national experience – seems a perfect moment for the reconsideration of our religious heritage and of the laws that have banished the wisdom of that heritage from our public life.”

My bold. What fucking religiously inspired war?!? Does he refer to the fact that religion is the blinding mechanism by which it enables young, middle-class men of Islam to throw their lives away for a chance at glory and definite reward after murdering innocents? Why, then I agree, but I can't agree with the insinuation that it is only their religion which has led us this far - it is also the religion of GW Bush. I'm not sure if he denies this or not, but the immediately following item is one religiously inspired President. :huh:

I'll try to fix what I see wrong with this quote of his.He adds, “The present American moment – when a religiously inspired global war, a religiously inspired president, an increasingly religious population and religiously inflamed politics all shape the national experience – seems a perfect moment for the abandoning of our religions and championing the laws that have banished the lunacy of that scourge from our public life.”
Now it fucking makes sense!

Astinus
June 12, 2007, 09:48 AM
*bashes head against wall*

–The U. S. Constitution does not even mention the words “separation of church and state; they were not even penned until fourteen years after the First Amendment became law.

The founding fathers mentioned it and supported it, including James Madison.

–Thomas Jefferson, supposedly a non-religious man who wanted a secular America, attended church for years in the United States capitol building.

OMG TJ attended church! Thomas Jefferson also was the one who said the first amendment should act as a "wall of separation" between church and state, and refused to proclaim a national day of prayer because of it.

–The First Amendment was never intended to apply to the states, only the federal government.

Ugh. You hear this a lot, but in fact many people believed that the Constitution applied to every form of government in the US. That wasn't even a controversy until after the Civil War, when the federal government ended slavery via the 13th amendment and then made the 14th amendment which said "yes, all you Southern states, that applies to you."

–The Supreme Court Justice who wrote the disastrous decision that secularized the First Amendment was a member of the KKK and was so incompetent that one of his fellow Justices suggested he go back to law school.

wha?

--Current United States law allows organizations like the ACLU to sue school districts and towns over religious symbols and then have their legal fees paid by the losers if they win the case. This means that for the ACLU, dismantling America’s religious heritage has become a profit-making venture—and all at the expense of school districts, towns and even veterans’ cemeteries.

You've got to be kidding me. They get their attorney fees paid for, which is common practice with lawsuits were the plaintiff wins.

--Stephen Mansfield writes about “Faith-Based Blackmail” in which the ACLU threatens a school district with a lawsuit and the school district caves in because they can’t afford to pay the ACLU’s legal fees if they lose. This has meant that Bible studies and even the Boy Scouts have been driven from public property without a fight—all because of the ACLU’s “Faith-Based Blackmail.”

Oh no, they're forced to stop unconstitutional practices without a fight. The horrors. A massive lawsuit would obviously be better for everyone.

Yet another fundie history revisionist.

Izmir Stinger
June 12, 2007, 11:23 AM
–The U. S. Constitution does not even mention the words “separation of church and state; they were not even penned until fourteen years after the First Amendment became law.

People always sound surprised to discover this. The reason they are surprised is, of course, because they have not read the constitution. When they discover (second hand of course, they still haven't read it) that this phrase is not used in the constitution they present its absence as an argument that the concept of a "wall of separation" is not supported by the constitution.

I love it when some nincompoop opens this door in a debate. I can name another document they haven't read, yet claim to know the content and meaning of. The Holy Bible. They might be surprised to learn that nowhere in this voluminous tome is the phrase "holy trinity." The word trinity is not present anywhere in the Bible. By their own reasoning, because this terminology does not appear in the Bible, the concept of the ontological trinity is not supported by the Bible. Let's see what other Christian doctrines we can demolish in this manner. That is a cliched example, though. I like to pick meaner examples. The following words and phrases are NOT in the Bible:

Atheist
Rapture
Abortion
Purgatory
Birth Control
Condom
Homosexual
Second Coming
Apocalypse
Premarital Sex
Conservative (Liberal is in there several times, though)

This is just off the top of my head. Think of some words or phrases that you wish the anti-separation fuckers would stop harping about and plug them into the search engine at http://www.biblegateway.com/. Chances are, the Bible doesn't mention it.

Turnabout's fair play you uneducated asshats.

dancer_rnb
June 12, 2007, 11:45 AM
Another thing people need to realize is many church state cases are brought about
by minority Christians sects with different beliefs from the majority, not unbelievers.

Toto
June 12, 2007, 04:45 PM
Stephen Mansfield is The New York Times best selling author of The Faith of George W. Bush, ....

From amazon: 76 used & new available from $0.01

In this favorable look at the politics and faith of the nation's current president, Mansfield, who has penned several historical biographies with faith emphases, examines Bush's spiritual journey and discusses how it shapes his administration. Although he writes that Bush's faith has waxed and waned over the years, Bush "is among a small number of American presidents to have undergone a profound religious transformation as an adult... he came to the presidency, then, with the zeal of the newly converted." To understand the president's brand of faith, Mansfield traces his family legacy, his boyhood in Midland, Tex., his playboy years and his lifelong love affair with baseball. Bush's marriage to Laura helped stabilize him spiritually, and Mansfield details later encounters with evangelists Arthur Blessit and Billy Graham that he believes were pivotal in Bush's spiritual formation. He also shows the role of Bush's Christianity in running for various offices, implementing faith-based initiatives and responding to 9/11 and war in Afghanistan and Iraq. Throughout the book, Mansfield offers his own interpretations about events in writing that is often rich and specific in detail. Noticeably absent is commentary on Bush's controversial environmental policies and how his faith has-or has not-informed them.

gilraen
June 12, 2007, 05:16 PM
how his faith has-or has not-informed them.
(derail) That's something I've always wondered -- how can faith inform anyone or anything? It seems like a massive contradiction in terms. (/derail)

Coragyps
June 12, 2007, 05:46 PM
The Faith of George W. Bush, ....
From amazon: 76 used & new available from $0.01

That's too much to pay, though!

Vandeervecken
June 14, 2007, 01:56 AM
Blind faith is nothing more than ignorance in a pretty dress.

GenesisNemesis
June 14, 2007, 02:07 AM
-The Supreme Court Justice who wrote the disastrous decision that secularized the First Amendment was a member of the KKK and was so incompetent that one of his fellow Justices suggested he go back to law school.

http://rationalrevolution.net/images/kkk_jesus_saves.gif