The 10 Most Insane Medical Practices in History

[Potoooooooo]

http://www.cracked.com/article_15669_10-most-insane-medical-practices-in-history.html

[skepticalbip]

Yeah, we've come a long way in ideas about healing since those.

Now we have much more effective measures such as:

1. Taping magnets of specific body areas.
2. Prayer groups sending "healing energies".
3. Positioning crystals around the patient.
4. Homeopathy.
5. Psychic surgery.
6. etc.

[GenesisNemesis]

Some on this forum adhere to the view that these practices actually work. :rolleyes:

[premjan]

I guess trepanation is nothing compared to lobotomy and may actually work.

[WCH]

Thing is, a lot of the stuff in that article actually does work. And in the discussion of curing your cough with heroin they're acting like we don't use potent drugs as cough suppressants now. To my knowledge, the two most popular principle ingredients in cough-syrups are Dextromethorphan and Codeine... Codeine is an opiate, so it's not really much different than using Heroin. Meaning we haven't really come very far.

[skepticalbip]

Some on this forum adhere to the view that these practices actually work. :rolleyes:I know. My girlfriend believes most of the ones that I listed are effective. You wouldn't believe the number of crystals and magnets she has and she practices sending "healing energies" regularly (among several other ideas about "healing").

[Berthold]

I disobeyed one of the recommendations (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Urine_therapy) in the link. :devil1: (well, that one wasn't new to me)

Wasn't clitoridectomy fashionable in the USA too, around 1900?

[LeoM]

Yeah, we've come a long way in ideas about healing since those.

Now we have much more effective measures such as:

1. Taping magnets of specific body areas.
2. Prayer groups sending "healing energies".
3. Positioning crystals around the patient.
4. Homeopathy.
5. Psychic surgery.
6. etc.

I know homeopathy has some experimental support, as far as psychic surgery is not even widely accepted among parapsychologists mainly because it's among the least well documented of all paranormal claims.

[skepticalbip]

Yeah, we've come a long way in ideas about healing since those.

Now we have much more effective measures such as:

1. Taping magnets of specific body areas.
2. Prayer groups sending "healing energies".
3. Positioning crystals around the patient.
4. Homeopathy.
5. Psychic surgery.
6. etc.

I know homeopathy has some experimental support, as far as psychic surgery is not even widely accepted among parapsychologists mainly because it's among the least well documented of all paranormal claims.Of course homeopathy has some experimental support - about the same as placebo effect. Magnets, crystals, obeah, and sugar pills likewise.

ETA:
By the way, if homeopathy worked like the believers in it claim then it has nothing to do with parapsychology - it would be purely a materialist thingy.

[purple_kathryn]

don't doctors still perform trepanation to relieve pressure on the brain? (eg after a brain injury)

[Yggdrasill]

They do. Trepanation

Bloodletting also has a purpose in modern medicine. It is the preferred treatment for Hemochromatosis and some other diseases. (Thank you, House.)

Whether these things should be on the list is debatable.

[javarush]

don't doctors still perform trepanation to relieve pressure on the brain? (eg after a brain injury)

Modern trepanation is generally a technique for cranial access only; e.g. for instrumentation or evacuation of clots (hematomas) or tumors. The modern terms are craniotomy (replacement of skull piece) and craniectomy (non-replacement of skull piece). It is not currently a first-line therapy by itself. In cases of elevated intracranial pressure (ICP), the preferred treatment is medical (e.g. 100% O2, osmotic diuretics, induced coma) and not surgical. There is some case-study evidence for the positive value of decompressive craniectomy, but it is still the subject of continuing studies.

[apatura_iris]

http://cdn-www.cracked.com/articleimages/wong/hysteriacure2.jpg

Seriously?

[Lógos Sokratikós]

They do. Trepanation

Bloodletting also has a purpose in modern medicine. It is the preferred treatment for Hemochromatosis and some other diseases. (Thank you, House.)

Whether these things should be on the list is debatable.

It's debatable if all those people had hemochromatosis.

[Lógos Sokratikós]

http://cdn-www.cracked.com/articleimages/wong/hysteriacure2.jpg

Seriously?

It might actually work. Especially if Dr Freud was right and all those uptight Victorian ladies were exactly that −uptight. All they needed was to have sexual pleasure without guilt. After all it wasn't eroticism... it was sober medical science... ;)

[Yggdrasill]

don't doctors still perform trepanation to relieve pressure on the brain? (eg after a brain injury)

Modern trepanation is generally a technique for cranial access only; e.g. for instrumentation or evacuation of clots (hematomas) or tumors. The modern terms are craniotomy (replacement of skull piece) and craniectomy (non-replacement of skull piece). It is not currently a first-line therapy by itself. In cases of elevated intracranial pressure (ICP), the preferred treatment is medical (e.g. 100% O2, osmotic diuretics, induced coma) and not surgical. There is some case-study evidence for the positive value of decompressive craniectomy, but it is still the subject of continuing studies.I think we can assume that they didn't have those things 8500 years ago, so I think we can let it slide that they used trepanation instead of it's alternatives. ;)

What probably happened was that a bunch of people got whacked over the head, and someone noticed that those who got an open wound were more likely to survive than those with a closed wound. So they figured that opening up the wounds let out the wound demons or something. Then they figured that if it let out the demons in the case of head trauma, it would probably let out the demons in other circumstances as well.

[Lógos Sokratikós]

Exactly, Yggdrasill. Many of those procedures came from real observations, over which some wackoes became over-enthusiastic.

[Yggdrasill]

They do. Trepanation

Bloodletting also has a purpose in modern medicine. It is the preferred treatment for Hemochromatosis and some other diseases. (Thank you, House.)

Whether these things should be on the list is debatable.

It's debatable if all those people had hemochromatosis.I think we can be pretty sure they didn't all have hemochromatosis, but the point is they were onto something. It wasn't "insane", just misguided.

[wufwugy]

It's generally believed Mozart was poisoned by mercury-based syphilis cures, which contradicts the film Amadeus in which he was killed by writing too much music somehow.rofl

[WCH]

It's debatable if all those people had hemochromatosis.I think we can be pretty sure they didn't all have hemochromatosis, but the point is they were onto something. It wasn't "insane", just misguided.Yeah, same with trepanation. It's a valid procedure... very occasionally. The problem was a lack of diagnostic tools to know when to and when not to.

[Sapho]

http://cdn-www.cracked.com/articleimages/wong/hysteriacure2.jpg

Seriously?

It might actually work. Especially if Dr Freud was right and all those uptight Victorian ladies were exactly that −uptight. All they needed was to have sexual pleasure without guilt. After all it wasn't eroticism... it was sober medical science... ;)

And it cost their husbands plenty, which served the barstards right!

[Deleet]

Some on this forum adhere to the view that these practices actually work. :rolleyes:I know. My girlfriend believes most of the ones that I listed are effective. You wouldn't believe the number of crystals and magnets she has and she practices sending "healing energies" regularly (among several other ideas about "healing").

For some reasons women more often fall into this trap. I own a skeptical medicine nook, and I, just for a quick goof, asked my mother about all the treatments in it. She believed in more then 90% of them. I was shocked.

[Lógos Sokratikós]

Yeah, we've come a long way in ideas about healing since those.

Now we have much more effective measures such as:

1. Taping magnets of specific body areas.
2. Prayer groups sending "healing energies".
3. Positioning crystals around the patient.
4. Homeopathy.
5. Psychic surgery.
6. etc.

I know homeopathy has some experimental support, as far as psychic surgery is not even widely accepted among parapsychologists mainly because it's among the least well documented of all paranormal claims.

Oh, relief.

[Lógos Sokratikós]

It might actually work. Especially if Dr Freud was right and all those uptight Victorian ladies were exactly that −uptight. All they needed was to have sexual pleasure without guilt. After all it wasn't eroticism... it was sober medical science... ;)

And it cost their husbands plenty, which served the barstards right!

It wasn't entirely their fault. The women were raised to be "virtuous" (meaning many a times "frigid") and the men were raised to mary a wife virtuous enough to raise "respectable" children, which was the reason they had ("had") to find non-"virtuous" ladies for pleasure.

It was basically nobody's fault and everybody's fault. It was all ignorance.

Horrible times to live in.

[Lógos Sokratikós]

Lobotomy horror story.

Lobotomy

Rosemary Kennedy, the sister of President John F. Kennedy, was given a lobotomy when her father complained to doctors about the 23-year-old's moodiness. Dr. Walter Freeman personally performed the procedure. Rather than any improvement, however, the lobotomy reduced Rosemary to an infantile mentality including incontinence. Her verbal skills were reduced to unintelligible babble. Her father hid the nature of Rosemary's affliction for years and described it as the result of mental retardation. Rosemary's sister Eunice Kennedy Shriver founded the Special Olympics in her honor in 1968.

The really shocking part was this:

We went through the top of the head, I think she was awake. She had a mild tranquilizer. I made a surgical incision in the brain through the skull. It was near the front. It was on both sides. We just made a small incision, no more than an inch." The instrument Dr. Watts used looked like a butter knife. He swung it up and down to cut brain tissue. "We put an instrument inside," he said. As Dr. Watts cut, Dr. Freeman put questions to Rosemary. For example, he asked her to recite the Lord's Prayer or sing "God Bless America" or count backwards. ... "We made an estimate on how far to cut based on how she responded." ... When she began to become incoherent, they stopped.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rosemary_Kennedy#Lobotomy

Could they have used a more stupid or uncaring criterion?

[spikepipsqueak]

Stories of bright, fiesty women being lobotomised to stop them being so troublesome are not uncommon.

[wufwugy]

wrt lobotomy horror story: i find that so amazingly sad. how dare we call ourselves the most intelligent species when we can systematically do things like that.

[Lógos Sokratikós]

wrt lobotomy horror story: i find that so amazingly sad. how dare we call ourselves the most intelligent species when we can systematically do things like that.

The paradox is, that if we weren't this intelligent we wouldn't be capable of doing something like that! LOL

More than intelligence we need to be less demonic and less wasteful of our marbles.

[xaxxat]

Yeah, we've come a long way in ideas about healing since those.

Now we have much more effective measures such as:

1. Taping magnets of specific body areas.


Horse breeders and trainers might argue with you on that one...

[skepticalbip]

Yeah, we've come a long way in ideas about healing since those.

Now we have much more effective measures such as:

1. Taping magnets of specific body areas.


Horse breeders and trainers might argue with you on that one...If you are talking about the magnet in the stomachs of horses or cows to stop bits of metal they ingest from passing on into the intestines then that is a completely different thing. The people who are into "magnet therapy" are claiming something else entirely.

[general_koffi]

Yeah, we've come a long way in ideas about healing since those.

Now we have much more effective measures such as:

1. Taping magnets of specific body areas.
2. Prayer groups sending "healing energies".
3. Positioning crystals around the patient.
4. Homeopathy.
5. Psychic surgery.
6. etc.

At least the actual medical profession recognizes those as bullshit.

And the odd homeopathic thing might do something beyond placebo. But yeah... By and large, rubbish.

I think the lobotomy wins by virtue of being performed so recently. *shudders*.

That cough syrup at number 10 on Cracked's list sounds like a fucking trip. :)

It isn't listed at cracked, but at one point cocaine was prescribed for morphine addiction. (Wee... Who needs morphine on coke? Who needs fucking anything when they're on coke. :) )

There's also the matter of chemical castration and hormone treatments that people arrested for being gay are subjected to in parts of the world today.

[vixstile]

Homeopathy is one of the least plausible and unsupported forms of popular quackery out there now.

[purple_kathryn]

I was explaining to my mum about the "soothing syrups" they used to give children to keep them quiet

and she informs me that my gran used to give me (and presumbly my brother and cousins etc) potchin (moonshine) to keep us quiet :eek:

I pointed out that at least there was no heroin in it

[xaxxat]

Horse breeders and trainers might argue with you on that one...If you are talking about the magnet in the stomachs of horses or cows to stop bits of metal they ingest from passing on into the intestines then that is a completely different thing. The people who are into "magnet therapy" are claiming something else entirely.

Not talking about that. Race horse breeders use magnets to speed up recovery from injuries. Evidently it they think it works well enough.

[skepticalbip]

If you are talking about the magnet in the stomachs of horses or cows to stop bits of metal they ingest from passing on into the intestines then that is a completely different thing. The people who are into "magnet therapy" are claiming something else entirely.

Not talking about that. Race horse breeders use magnets to speed up recovery from injuries. Evidently it they think it works well enough.
That's interesting... I didn't know they did this. Has there been any controlled studies to determine if it is really effective or is it more like the other superstitious rituals that most people in most sports just swear works (like wearing the same set of underwear for the rest of the season after having a good game)?

This practice, at least, wouldn't violate the first rule of medicine, "first do no harm".

[xaxxat]

Not talking about that. Race horse breeders use magnets to speed up recovery from injuries. Evidently it they think it works well enough.
That's interesting... I didn't know they did this. Has there been any controlled studies to determine if it is really effective or is it more like the other superstitious rituals that most people in most sports just swear works (like wearing the same set of underwear for the rest of the season after having a good game)?

This practice, at least, wouldn't violate the first rule of medicine, "first do no harm".

Are horses superstitious? Maybe placebo effect works on them too. :Cheeky:

I know of no study. I do know there's quite a market for the products and a lot of testimonials for them. They seem to find them effective. I have no personal experience so I can't say.

[skepticalbip]

That's interesting... I didn't know they did this. Has there been any controlled studies to determine if it is really effective or is it more like the other superstitious rituals that most people in most sports just swear works (like wearing the same set of underwear for the rest of the season after having a good game)?

This practice, at least, wouldn't violate the first rule of medicine, "first do no harm".
Are horses superstitious? Maybe placebo effect works on them too. :Cheeky: I doubt it but the trainer who is the one that is making the judgment and claims that it works could be. ;)

I know of no study. I do know there's quite a market for the products and a lot of testimonials for them. They seem to find them effective. I have no personal experience so I can't say.
If it is that common then it looks like it would be a good chance to actually do a somewhat limited study (I doubt the owner of a prize horse would allow for magnetic treatment only without the other normal treatments). But you could have half the horses being treated for injuries normally and the other half treated normally plus the magnets. The study could be somewhat blinded by having the panel making the judgment of how well each horse is healing not know which group the horse was in (it's doubtful that the horse would tell). It may make for an interesting study, but then maybe not.

[Reason]

Leeches and maggots are still used in modern medicine. The former is the most efficacious way to restore blood flow to reattached extremeties, and the latter the best way to debride necrotic tissue from a wound without destroying living tissue.

[vixstile]

There is no reason to believe magnets would have any effect on recovery in the first place. Magnetic fields simply don't any effect our tissue. This is known.

As far as the trainers believing they do help: Simple. They're just wrong and they believe in something stupid, like magnets having some effect on healing. That's not a stretch. Humans do it all the godamned time.

[Jimmy Higgins]

wrt lobotomy horror story: i find that so amazingly sad. how dare we call ourselves the most intelligent species when we can systematically do things like that.

The paradox is, that if we weren't this intelligent we wouldn't be capable of doing something like that! LOL The actual paradox is thatthis mindless mutilation had benefits that we probably have benefited from. To think all the mindless, though even compassionate at times, care people received 50 to 80 years ago, has actually led to breakthroughs or better understandings as to what does not work.

Thing is, a lot of the stuff in that article actually does work. And in the discussion of curing your cough with heroin they're acting like we don't use potent drugs as cough suppressants now. To my knowledge, the two most popular principle ingredients in cough-syrups are Dextromethorphan and Codeine... Codeine is an opiate, so it's not really much different than using Heroin. Meaning we haven't really come very far.
I think our journey has come far at least in the sense of disease and prevention. We are better are keeping plagues from occurring, thanks to decent sanitation. Of course, I speak of the doctors, not the population in general, of which needed to be constantly reminded that hand contact with a homosexual wouldn't give them AIDS.

Granted, doctors are in the blue about a bunch of stuff, especially neurology. Of course, now days we have a Pharmaceutical Industrial Complex which is ironically impeding our nation's health by concentrating on treating people for problems that aren't exactly the most important concerns.... all in the name of obtaining profits, not bettering our living standards.

[xaxxat]

There is no reason to believe magnets would have any effect on recovery in the first place. Magnetic fields simply don't any effect our tissue. This is known.

As far as the trainers believing they do help: Simple. They're just wrong and they believe in something stupid, like magnets having some effect on healing. That's not a stretch. Humans do it all the godamned time.

Are you a horse trainer? Don't you think the trainers could see the difference in the horse's performance?

Maybe these guys have it all wrong and they need your help...

[vixstile]

There is no reason to believe magnets would have any effect on recovery in the first place. Magnetic fields simply don't any effect our tissue. This is known.

As far as the trainers believing they do help: Simple. They're just wrong and they believe in something stupid, like magnets having some effect on healing. That's not a stretch. Humans do it all the godamned time.

Are you a horse trainer? Don't you think the trainers could see the difference in the horse's performance?

Maybe these guys have it all wrong and they need your help...


You don't have to be a horse trainer to know magnets aren't going to help healing. You just have to not be an idiot.

Magnet therapy is nonsense. Period.

[doghouse]

Don't you think the trainers could see the difference in the horse's performance?

I can't think of any other group that is as susceptible to hocus pocus treatments as trainers of performance horses. A whole lot of people have become rich selling such crap to trainers with the promise that it will help their horse wine the next race, event or show.

[xaxxat]

Yeah, those guys must be idiots to use something that works without the official approval of the authorities on everything. I wonder how anything ever worked before you authorities on everything came along...

[Jimmy Higgins]

Are you a horse trainer? Don't you think the trainers could see the difference in the horse's performance?

Maybe these guys have it all wrong and they need your help...


You don't have to be a horse trainer to know magnets aren't going to help healing. You just have to not be an idiot.

Magnet therapy is nonsense. Period.Since when did someone need to be a horse trainer to understand physiology? Horse trainers are pumping steroids into their horses so they become faster and stronger, so strong that their skeletons are having issues handling their strength.

[doghouse]

Yeah, those guys must be idiots to use something that works without the official approval of the authorities on everything. I wonder how anything ever worked before you authorities on everything came along...

I just calls em like I sees em. The point is there's no scientific evidence that they work. And no, the fact that a trainer uses something is not adequate evidence of benefit.

I'm not saying anyone is an idiot, just that in my experience horse trainers employ a lot of things that have no documented efficacy or safety.

[general_koffi]

Yeah, those guys must be idiots to use something that works without the official approval of the authorities on everything. I wonder how anything ever worked before you authorities on everything came along...

We haven't been told what the magnets are supposed to be doing.

It is physically impossible for a magnetic field to affect blood or tissue, but maybe strapping something hard and heavy, like a magnet, has another affect on an animal. Maybe it discourages them from moving limbs.

What, exactly, are the magnets supposed to do?

[Loren Pechtel]

They do. Trepanation

Bloodletting also has a purpose in modern medicine. It is the preferred treatment for Hemochromatosis and some other diseases. (Thank you, House.)

Whether these things should be on the list is debatable.

Not only that, but back in the old days there was no other treatment for high blood pressure. Thus bloodletting *DID* help many patients.

Furthermore, consider things like Lourdes. Again, there was a real health benefit for many people. It had nothing to do with the location, but rather being upright in water for an extended period. Hot springs were the only place where you could actually do that without hypothermia problems.

[skepticalbip]

A few things to consider:

1. Do the "magnet therapists" have a model that describes how a magnetic field interacts with damaged tissue to promote healing? If so, has it been tested in a lab and verified?

2. Any effective therapeutic treatment has symptoms of overdose. - An overdose of heat treatment causes blisters; an overdose of cold compacts causes frost bite; an overdose of radiation treatment causes the death of healthy cells. What are the symptoms of a magnet overdose?

3. If you turn the magnet over so that the opposite pole is against the patient does it make the condition worse?

4. What is the effect of magnets on undamaged tissue?

Although I am quite skeptical that magnets have any therapeutic effect (other than placebo), it may be worth investigating. After all we have found that some very unlikely sounding folk remedies are beneficial (though most not... I've never see that burying a washcloth under the back porch under a full moon has been very effective a eliminating warts, but have heard some people claim that it works ;)).
.

[doghouse]

What, exactly, are the magnets supposed to do?

They are sometimes used for a variety of injuries such as bowed tendons (tendonitis) and osteoarthritis. The claim is they decrease inflammation, increase circulation, speed healing and other fairly nonspecific claims.

There have been a few studies:

Steyn, et al.J Am Vet Med Assoc. 2000 Sep 15;217(6):874-7. Effect of a static magnetic field on blood flow to the metacarpus in horses.

"Results suggest that in horses, the static magnetic field associated with application of commercially available magnetic wraps for 48 hours does not increase blood flow to the portion of the metacarpus underneath the wrap."


Martel GF, Andrews SC, Roseboom CG. J Orthop Sports Phys Ther. 2002 Oct;32(10):518-24. Comparison of static and placebo magnets on resting forearm blood flow in young, healthy men.

"Exposure to static magnets for up to 30 minutes had the same effect on resting forearm blood flow and vascular resistance as placebo magnets. These data suggest that static magnets do not result in significant alterations in resting blood flow."

[vixstile]

Oooh, actual science trumps the anecdotes of laymen again. Who would have thunk it? :huh:

[xaxxat]

What, exactly, are the magnets supposed to do?

They are sometimes used for a variety of injuries such as bowed tendons (tendonitis) and osteoarthritis. The claim is they decrease inflammation, increase circulation, speed healing and other fairly nonspecific claims.

There have been a few studies:

Steyn, et al.J Am Vet Med Assoc. 2000 Sep 15;217(6):874-7. Effect of a static magnetic field on blood flow to the metacarpus in horses.

"Results suggest that in horses, the static magnetic field associated with application of commercially available magnetic wraps for 48 hours does not increase blood flow to the portion of the metacarpus underneath the wrap."


Martel GF, Andrews SC, Roseboom CG. J Orthop Sports Phys Ther. 2002 Oct;32(10):518-24. Comparison of static and placebo magnets on resting forearm blood flow in young, healthy men.

"Exposure to static magnets for up to 30 minutes had the same effect on resting forearm blood flow and vascular resistance as placebo magnets. These data suggest that static magnets do not result in significant alterations in resting blood flow."

How does one find a "placebo magnet"? My understanding is that one of the reasons studies are hard to do is that the subjects can't be blinded to the magnets like they can be to a pill. It's kind of hard to fake a magnet.

[Yggdrasill]

How does one find a "placebo magnet"? My understanding is that one of the reasons studies are hard to do is that the subjects can't be blinded to the magnets like they can be to a pill. It's kind of hard to fake a magnet.You use a block of metal that has the same size and weight, and has a surface that looks identical to that of a magnet. If you don't give them any metal to test the "magnet" against, they won't know the difference.

[xaxxat]

How does one find a "placebo magnet"? My understanding is that one of the reasons studies are hard to do is that the subjects can't be blinded to the magnets like they can be to a pill. It's kind of hard to fake a magnet.You use a block of metal that has the same size and weight, and has a surface that looks identical to that of a magnet. If you don't give them any metal to test the "magnet" against, they won't know the difference.

That makes sense. So then, why the complaints that the studies can't be relied on because the subjects can't be properly blinded?

[xaxxat]

How does one find a "placebo magnet"? My understanding is that one of the reasons studies are hard to do is that the subjects can't be blinded to the magnets like they can be to a pill. It's kind of hard to fake a magnet.You use a block of metal that has the same size and weight, and has a surface that looks identical to that of a magnet. If you don't give them any metal to test the "magnet" against, they won't know the difference.

That's what was done in this study:
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9E03E5DF173CF93AA35751C1A961958260

The blinding problem still remained. The results are interesting.

[doghouse]

That makes sense. So then, why the complaints that the studies can't be relied on because the subjects can't be properly blinded?

You will probably have to ask them.

In the meantime I'm going to guess .... conflict of interest.

[xaxxat]

That makes sense. So then, why the complaints that the studies can't be relied on because the subjects can't be properly blinded?

You will probably have to ask them.

In the meantime I'm going to guess .... conflict of interest.

Well, the people conducting the studies and finding positive results complain about the problem too...

[Togo]

How about this one?

Tudor barber surgeons were selected based on experience. An experienced doctor would more likely leave you alive. An experienced doctor would have done much surgury before, so a bloodstained coat was de rigeur. This built up to such an extreme degree that people would never wash their surgury coat, and apprentices had to throw the coat on the ground and stamp on it before each surgury, to allow arms of the coat to move.

(Health warning, this came from a major newspaper and thus may be absolute rubbish....)

[SteveP]

I'd believe that; a surgeon's blood-stained coat was a matter of professional pride.

When Lister in the 19th century became convinced that post-surgery infection was the result of little tiny invisible greeblies (preposterous notion... :rolleyes:), he would forcibly wash surgeons' hands before they went into surgery.

[SteveP]

When Amanda Feilding's boyfriend Joey Mellen attempted to drill a hole in his own head he was promptly put in an insane asylum.

Some years ago local student radio interviewed Feilding. She was surprisingly lucid and convincing. She postulates that the loss of childhood's sense of wonder is the result of the skull's bones fusing; confining the blood's pulsing through the brain. A hole in the skull would allow blood vessels to expand and contract with the pulse, maintaining constant flow.
She advocates trepanation as a state-subsidised out-patient procedure.

After the ad break, the radio station interviewed a specialist who pretty much said the whole idea was bollocks.

It's an intriguing idea though; we know that evolution makes compromises, perhaps it is the case that a solid, more blow resistant skull was more advantageous to our ancestors than not feeling miserable. Bipedalism of course places extra demands on the circulatory system.
We know that evolution of the rest of the body hasn't quite caught up to homo's recent bipedalism: back pain and failed knee joints are evidence of that... :huh:

Now hand me the Black & Decker...

[doghouse]

She postulates that the loss of childhood's sense of wonder is the result of the skull's bones fusing; confining the blood's pulsing through the brain. A hole in the skull would allow blood vessels to expand and contract with the pulse, maintaining constant flow.
She advocates trepanation as a state-subsidised out-patient procedure.

She's not the first to have that idea. In the 1780s, Alexander Monro deduced that since the skull was a rigid container filled with noncompressable material (brain and blood), the amount of blood within the skull must remain constant or pressure within the skull will rise. Monro's pupil, George Kellie confirmed these observations.

The problem was cerebrospinal fluid was not discovered until later. Now we know the skull doesn't contain just brain and blood, there is also CSF. During each systolic phase of the heartbeat as the amount of arterial blood within the skull increases, there is movement of an equal volume of CSF out of the skull into the spine. During diastole, a bit of CSF flows back into the skull.

So put down the drill, nature has already taken care of the problem.

Monro and Kellie are remembered today as the Monro-Kellie Doctrine, a basic tenet of neurosurgery that describes the relationships between intracranial pressure, volume of CSF, blood, and brain tissue,

[HaysooChreesto!]

Yeah, those guys must be idiots to use something that works without the official approval of the authorities on everything. I wonder how anything ever worked before you authorities on everything came along...

Dude, just accept the fact that horses don't benefit from magnets. Consider also that people still believe in a sky genie who's going to come down any day now* and take their clothes off and bring them to a magical place where they'll live forever and ever. People believing that magnates will help a horse are pikers by compare.

*Any damn day now!

[xaxxat]

Yeah, those guys must be idiots to use something that works without the official approval of the authorities on everything. I wonder how anything ever worked before you authorities on everything came along...

Dude, just accept the fact that horses don't benefit from magnets. Consider also that people still believe in a sky genie who's going to come down any day now* and take their clothes off and bring them to a magical place where they'll live forever and ever. People believing that magnates will help a horse are pikers by compare.

*Any damn day now!


Dewd, magnates don't help horses? Fer sher, like totally? And what do magnates, like, have to with, like, religion, ya know?

[SteveP]

She postulates that the loss of childhood's sense of wonder is the result of the skull's bones fusing; confining the blood's pulsing through the brain. A hole in the skull would allow blood vessels to expand and contract with the pulse, maintaining constant flow.
She advocates trepanation as a state-subsidised out-patient procedure.

She's not the first to have that idea. In the 1780s, Alexander Monro deduced that since the skull was a rigid container filled with noncompressable material (brain and blood), the amount of blood within the skull must remain constant or pressure within the skull will rise. Monro's pupil, George Kellie confirmed these observations.

The problem was cerebrospinal fluid was not discovered until later. Now we know the skull doesn't contain just brain and blood, there is also CSF. During each systolic phase of the heartbeat as the amount of arterial blood within the skull increases, there is movement of an equal volume of CSF out of the skull into the spine. During diastole, a bit of CSF flows back into the skull.

So put down the drill, nature has already taken care of the problem.



Ok phew thanks doghouse!

Monro and Kellie are remembered today as the Monro-Kellie Doctrine, a basic tenet of neurosurgery that describes the relationships between intracranial pressure, volume of CSF, blood, and brain tissue,


"America for Americanians"...??? ;)

[doghouse]

Different Monro. :) Alexander was a Scot.

[Newton's Cat]

In rural Poland pre-WWII people consulted local "wise" men and women.

A treatment for acne:

The sufferer sits in a dimly lit room in front of a large mirror with a bowl of water on her lap in which a piece of charcoal is floating. A damp towel is placed on her head. Flax is placed on the towel and set alight. This procedure was supposed to promote rapid healing of the acne. The sufferer was probably given advice about her diet, etc., as well.

[Aria]

Yeah, we've come a long way in ideas about healing since those.

Now we have much more effective measures such as:

1. Taping magnets of specific body areas.
2. Prayer groups sending "healing energies".
3. Positioning crystals around the patient.
4. Homeopathy.
5. Psychic surgery.
6. etc.

I know homeopathy has some experimental support, as far as psychic surgery is not even widely accepted among parapsychologists mainly because it's among the least well documented of all paranormal claims.

By that you mean absolutely none. The idea behind homeopathy is flatly insane and it has been debunked numerous times. It is absolutely a fact that it doesn't work.