Non Decaying Saints

[Marduk]

Anyone know of an explanation why some bodies don’t decay? I caught a tidbit on TV the other night about the bodies of Saints that show no sign of decay after death. They showed St. Bernadette in her glass coffin looking like sleeping beauty after being dead for over a hundred years, this was first discovered after her body was first exhumed for reburial several years after her death. She didn't even look mummified. And she wasn't even embalmed.
Now I read of another dead nun who refuses to decompose and they are scrambling to get her in the running for Sainthood, the Catholic Church doesn’t seem to know how to handle it. What’s up with this? Inquiring minds want to know.

[ March 09, 2002: Message edited by: marduck ]</p>

[Coragyps]

Hmmm. On a related note, I saw a really beautiful art exhibit once in St Louis called "Angels from the Vatican." Lots of neat painting/icons/sculpture, and also a silver reliquary from maybe 1300 or so. It was about 6 feet tall, really ornate, and had a little glass window in its center where you could see a chunk of Saint Somebody's liver. It didn't look all that fresh to me.

[Synaesthesia]

Aside from the fact that saint's bodies are carefully preserved (coated in a thin layer of coloured wax for dramatic effect) evidently good people are not the only ones who fail to decay for an unusually long period of time.

http://www.skepdic.com/incorrupt.html

[joedad]

[quote]Originally posted by Synaesthesia:
<strong>Aside from the fact that saint's bodies are carefully preserved (coated in a thin layer of coloured wax for dramatic effect) evidently good people are not the only ones who fail to decay for an unusually long period of time.

http://www.skepdic.com/incorrupt.html

Mammoths must have been very holy indeed.

Also, lets not forget the Iceman found in the Alps. Perhaps he holds the record for holiness.

Bristlecone Pine wood barely rots. It rather erodes away over time. Remnants are close to ten thousand years old.

I remember watching some show recently where the blood of a long dead martyr reliquified every few years, whereupon it was paraded around town and adored as a miraculous sign.

And in White's City near Carlsbad Caverns is an Indian Mummfied Head with the hair still growing. Imagine that!

Pope John XXIII still gets himself brought out from time to time, and isn't Lenin still around too?

joe

[eh]

The link at Skepdic.com didn't mention Napoleon's body. When they dug his corpse up after a few decades of being the grave, his body appear to no signs of decay at all. Apparently, the presence of arsenic in his system prolongs the effects of decay. So maybe it's not so difficult to preserve a body at all?

[ex-idaho]

I don't recall the persons name but he was an American revolutionary patriot that was buried in a lead casket. The casket was exumed some 120 years later and the body no showed no signs of decay.

[B. H. Manners]

When Heinrich Schleiman (spelling?) excavated the ancient city of Mycenae in the late 1800's he found a corpse that seemed perfectly preserved except the hair. See Michael Wood's book The Trojan War for more details.

[atheist_in_foxhole]

I heard the same thing about Medgar Evers (the civil rights leader). His exhumed body was almost perfectly preserved after 30+ years in the grave. The Xians, predictably, said it was a miracle from god. I, on the other hand, wondered why a miracle performing god would have allowed this man to be shot in the back in the first place.

I guess it's all part of god's plan! &lt;/sarcasm&gt;

[ March 11, 2002: Message edited by: atheist_in_foxhole ]</p>

[Amen-Moses]

Decay is caused by biological processes, in particular the actions of bacteria. Lead (and Arsenic for that matter) has the property of being lethal to biological entities, especially bacteris.

This means that if a body is entombed in a lead coffin and the coffin is constructed near the body (i.e liquid lead is in abundance near the corpse) then the skin can be infused with lead which will kill any bacteria present. If in addition the corpse is of someone who came into contact with lead (Nuns and Monks tended to eat and drink with cheap lead utensils, use lead ink for copying parchments, read by candles or oil lamps containing lead and many medicines were based upon lead) then their innards could also be protected to some extent.

Amen-Moses

[kctan]

How come they are touted as saints ?

Back in those days, people should have chopped off the head, filled the mouth with garlic & driven a stake thru the heart.

There's only one explaination for dead people not decaying back in those days & it ain't spelled s-a-i-n-t.

:D :D :D

[Roach Clips]

So explain why the saints' bodies of God have not decayed...? In relation to God.. they devoted their lives ot God.. and still.. not their bodies began to rot.. For Example

Saint Bishoy His Body in the St. Bishoy Monastery in Natron Valley
Saint Sedhom Bishay His Body in St. Mary Church in Domiatta at Belkas Desert
Saint Yousab El Abah His Body in a glass box in St. Antonious Monastery at Red Sea
Saint Besada His Body in a glass box in St. Samouel El Motaref at Kalamoon Mountain.. and it goes on..

This is what a Xian said to me about Saints and how his religion must be true because of Saint's bodies that don't decay

[john_v_h]

Gee, it was on TV so it must be true? :rolleyes:

Take a look at the photographs here (http://www.catholicpilgrims.com/lourdes/lourdes_photo_aa.htm). Pay particular attention to the length and curve of the nose and the fullness of the lips. I would say the 1997 model has had quite a makeover. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised to find that what they're displaying is little more than a wax figure (face and hands only) built on top of a corpse (if any).

[ex-xian]

It's a miracle! This thread was dead for two and a half years and, now that it's been exhumed, it shows no signs of decay. Someone call the Vactican and get IIDB beatified.

[Javaman]

Roach Clips, not trying to be mean here but I'm facinated by the mechanics of finding threads on this forum long faded into obscurity. How did you go about it?

Also, when I saw the thread title, I though the banned user 'pbaylis' had come back. (http://www.iidb.org/vbb/showthread.php?t=133628)

Further, in the 3 1/2 years I've been posting here, this is only my 8th post in this forum so I'm gonna give S&S a whirl since I like and do science.

[Santas little helper]

Decay is caused by biological processes, in particular the actions of bacteria. Lead (and Arsenic for that matter) has the property of being lethal to biological entities, especially bacteris.

This means that if a body is entombed in a lead coffin and the coffin is constructed near the body (i.e liquid lead is in abundance near the corpse) then the skin can be infused with lead which will kill any bacteria present. If in addition the corpse is of someone who came into contact with lead (Nuns and Monks tended to eat and drink with cheap lead utensils, use lead ink for copying parchments, read by candles or oil lamps containing lead and many medicines were based upon lead) then their innards could also be protected to some extent.
Now we need someone to experimentally test this with bodies of animals.Or even humans if they're willing to donate their bodies for such a purpose.

[Roach Clips]

Roach Clips, not trying to be mean here but I'm facinated by the mechanics of finding threads on this forum long faded into obscurity. How did you go about it?

Also, when I saw the thread title, I though the banned user 'pbaylis' had come back. (http://www.iidb.org/vbb/showthread.php?t=133628)

Further, in the 3 1/2 years I've been posting here, this is only my 8th post in this forum so I'm gonna give S&S a whirl since I like and do science.
I searched for "decay saint body" and this thread came up. It pertained to a question I was asked from a fundy. Therefore, I decided to bump up the thread in the hope that someone, who might be able to help me with a rebuttal, will reply.

Usually, if I can't find a thread, in the first few pages of a section, I use the "search" feature instead of making a whole new thread.

[Amen-Moses]

I searched for "decay saint body" and this thread came up. It pertained to a question I was asked from a fundy. Therefore, I decided to bump up the thread in the hope that someone, who might be able to help me with a rebuttal, will reply.

Well my remarks above about lead pertain to the more recent (i.e medievel and later) examples but the ones you listed seem to have something in common in that they come from a part of the world where mummification was common and by 400AD pretty much perfected.

I am reminded of a burial of a child from the same period that was recently unearthed (late 90's) and which is one of the best preserved mummifications ever seen. (and one of the most interesting because the child was neither royalty nor from a particularly rich family)

Amen-Moses

[Nialler]

Well the christian bodies that were preserved were obviously saints, while the other bodies were merely miracles which were probably arranged by saints.

They all involve the hand of god. It behoves us all to see his work when he gives us these clues. :rolleyes:

[Thief of Time]

I prefer to believe that they involve the foot of god. Occasionally the paw of god. And, very rarely, the scorpion tail of god.

Yes, maybe I believe in a very unorthodox god. But he's a lot more interesting. (He tells me to burn things)