Philosophy Forum Booklist?

[Hugo Holbling]

I'm starting this thread with the permission of Philosoft to discuss the benefits or otherwise of a philosophy forum reading list, similar to the one available in E/C (http://www.iidb.org/vbb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=44461). This came up in the context of arguing "you don't understand philosophy" or what-not, and perhaps some visitors genuinely don't. There have also been occasions on which, in my opinion, posters are simply talking past each other, or else where one participant has been bashing a useless straw man based on ignorance or a misunderstanding of the subject at hand.

I propose then that we use this thread to develop a list of books or articles that could make up a potential reading list for the philosophy forum. We can each either propose books (and links) and offer a supporting argument, or else second/critique the inclusion of the resources offered by others. What i don't intend is that this thread be used to attack strands of philosophy that we may not like; if you think continental philosophy is bunkum, for example, please suggest critical works that could go on the list as counterpoints, rather than provoking an argument about whether it "deserves" to be on the list in the first place. Another possibility for contributions would be to suggest yourself as an actual or proposed authority on your favourite region of philosophy to help Bill and Philosoft decide what should end up on the list; something of this kind needs to be done in order to avoid the list being unmanageably large and therefore superfluous.

Please post your suggestions, or else say why this whole endeavour is a bad idea that should be binned. For the time being, i hereby throw my hat into the ring for philosophy of science guy and will post some suggestions at a later date, depending how this thread develops.

:)

[Philosoft]

As per your suggestion, Hugo, I think we should let this be a kind of nominating thread. I was thinking that everyone interested might limit their choices to 3 or 5? Meanwhile, I'll consider ways to consolidate the list when it comes time.

~Philosoft

[jpbrooks]

A Philosophy booklist seems like a good idea as long as the books are not very expensive.

[King's Indian]

...and that none of the books are out of print, please?
If one does become so, then the list might have to be updated.

[Bill Snedden]

I think it's an excellent idea. I wonder, though, if we ought not to set some criteria prior to compilation. It might be helpful if we could focus on categories of works. Perhaps a category of books that are helpful in understanding philosophical concepts and the goal of philosophy in general, and then more specific categories like "realism" or "deconstructionism", etc.

Or, maybe the rest of you can simply toss in whatever you find valuable and Philosoft and I can sort them out...

Regards,

Bill Snedden

[Hugo Holbling]

What with Bill and Philosoft on-side, who wouldn't crash on ahead regardless? I offer some suggestions below and would appreciate it if you all would respond by seconding or rejecting (with reasons or, better yet, alternatives).

History of philosophy:

A History Of Philosophy In The Twentieth Century (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0801860164/qid=1048704165/sr=2-1/ref=sr_2_1/002-3871484-1806464) by Christian Delacampagne: a deep and fair insight into the whole gamut of thinkers. His treatment of Heidegger is masterful.

Philosophy of science:

Philosophy Of Science (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0393971759/qid%3D1048706450/sr%3D11-1/ref%3Dsr%5F11%5F1/002-3871484-1806464), edited by Curd and Cover: this must be considered the standard textbook, with a fine collection of essays.

What Is This Thing Called Science? (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0872204529/002-3871484-1806464?v=glance&s=books) by Alan Chalmers is still in print and provides a good introduction for those who don't want to spend more on Curd/Cover; his coverage of the Bayesians is especially good.

The Methodology Of Scientific Research Programmes (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0521280311/qid=1048707252/sr=1-3/ref=sr_1_3/002-3871484-1806464?v=glance&s=books), Volume 1, by Imre Lakatos: this work is a veritable masterpiece, whether you agree with him or not, and isn't covered in sufficient depth in either of the above references. His discussion of Popper, Kuhn, et al. is so thorough that those authors don't require a separate entry here, in my opinion.

I think that'll do - for now. :)

[Bill Snedden]

Heavens! I feel quite outgunned! :D

I was going to suggest Russell's Problems of Philosophy as a brief and accessible text on the goals of philosophy and some of its common stumbling blocks...

[Hugo Holbling]

Too late for sloppy posts, Bill - i've set the precedent! You'll need to add a link so that composing the eventual list will be a simple matter of collecting urls from the suggestions already made, thus saving the mods alot of time. Or were you hoping to slope the work off to Philosoft? :eek: :D

[the_cave]

Just read Copleston's history:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/search-handle-url/index=books&field-author=Copleston%20S.J.%2C%20Frederick/002-8858955-9041646

and you're done! Except for all the post-war thinkers, admittedly...

[Frotiw]

Philosophy of the mind:

David Chalmer's Homepage (http://www.u.arizona.edu/~chalmers/master.html)

Here is a cheap one(it's just a link) never the less it is without doubt one the best philosophy related homepages I have ever seen. I know at first it might seen a little overwhelming but actually it is a goldmine of articles and links not just Chalmers position is represented but practicly anything in philosophy(though with main focus on "philosophy of the mind" can be found here. I recommend trying out the "People with online papers in philosophy" under Resources. Here you may find links to many other well respected philosophers e.g. Ned Block(lots of his papers are online at his page).
I hope it's usefull.

Enjoy:) Frotiw

[phaedrus]

Plain ol' academic philosophy only ? :) camus, pirsig or books like "Thought probes : An Introduction to Philosophy through Science Fiction Literature- miller & smith" or the book my cousin likes a lot "sophie's world"

For those who want to build a library....this one could be of some help

Building a home philosophy library (http://philosophers.co.uk/cafe/library27.htm)

On a slightly offbeat note...what about books like "Seinfeld and Philosophy: A Book about Everything and Nothing" and "Simpsons and Philosophy: The D'oh! of Homer" :)
- william irwin....authored or co-authored these books

Philosophy, beginning in wonder ... is able to fancy everything different from what it is. It sees the familiar as if it were strange, and the strange as if it were familiar. It can take things up and lay them down again. Its mind is full of air that plays round every subject. It rouses us from our native dogmatic slumber and breaks up our caked prejudices....A man with no philosophy in him is the most inauspicious and unprofitable of all possible social mates. willliam james - Some Problems of Philosophy

Philosophy is at once the most sublime and the most trivial of human pursuits. WJ - Pragmatism/lecture 1

Philosophy aims at the logical clarification of thoughts. Philosophy is not a body of doctrine but an activity. A philosophical work consists essentially of elucidations. Philosophy does not result in philosophical propositions', but rather in the clarification of propositions. Without philosophy thoughts are, as it were, cloudy and indistinct: its task is to make them clear and to give them sharp boundaries.Wittgenstein - Tractatus Logico

[Hugo Holbling]

I'd like to second the recommendation of Copleston but i think some would consider it prohibitively expensive and too thorough to provide an introduction, which is why i put forward Delacampagne.

Bear in mind that visitors may ask for suggestions as to which books can help them get a grip on the discussions here and so this is the context in which we should be sending them to our nominated works. In my example, instead of suggesting that someone curious about philosophy of science should read a whole list of thinkers, i'd offer a collection that gives a good overview and would leave them with plenty of ideas as to where to go next if they wanted to explore it more deeply.

That's my opinion, anyway. :)

[Hugo Holbling]

Analytic Philosophy:

Twentieth Century Analytic Philosophy (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0231112211/qid=1048768720/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_1/002-3871484-1806464?v=glance&s=books) by Avrum Stroll is probably the best look at this aspect of philosophy. His coverage of Wittgenstein is especially nice.

I hope some more nominations will be offered soon, or else this will turn into my booklist. That won't do at all. :(

[Nowhere357]

The Tao of Physics by Fritjof Capra (http://search.barnesandnoble.com/booksearch/isbninquiry.asp?isbn=1570625190) is a common sense look at eastern philosophies - I recommend it for general philosophy reading.

I add my vote for texts that take an overview of philosophy. There is a lot of drivel and blather out there, I don't know how to sort through it all.

(I hope I did the hyperlink correctly.)

[Tyler Durden]

Nowhere357 There is a lot of drivel and blather out there, I don't know how to sort through it all.

How do I know your post is not full of drivel and blather? ;)

[Tyler Durden]

I would add Bryan Magee's Talking Philosophy (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0192854178/qid=1048800451/sr=1-7/ref=sr_1_7/002-7387230-1032830?v=glance&s=books) and The Great philosophers (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/019289322X/qid=1048800451/sr=2-2/ref=sr_2_2/002-7387230-1032830) for a good walk through.

The unique thing about these books is that Magee interviews the experts of the big names or the '..ism' subject.

[mac_philo]

I think this list is an excellent idea. I also think that we should include expensive and/or out of print books. People can use the library and the internet to locate rare materials. I highly doubt that the list will be overloaded with such texts.
Apologies for not providing URLs; I still use Lynx.
Epistemology/Scepticism:

Michael Williams, Unnatural Doubts. (excellent discussion of epistemology, scepticism, contextualism)
Linda Alcoff, Epistemology: The Big Questions (collected articles)

Philosophy of Language:
A.P. Martinich, The Philosophy of Language. (standard survey of the field)
Saul Kripke, Naming and Necessity. (causal theory of reference, necessity of identity statements)

Philosophy of Mathematics/Logic
Hilary Putnam and Paul Benacerraf, The Philosophy of Mathematics. (standard survey)
Richard Jeffrey, Formal Logic:Its Scope and Limits (first order logic, soundness, undecidability, uncompleteness)
GE Hughes and MG Creswell, A New Introduction to Modal Logic (standard introduction to modal systems)

History of Philosophy:
Frederick Copleston, A History of Philosophy (clear, comprehensive)
Bertrand Russell, History of Philosophy. (engaging, flawed)

[Bluenose]

1- Morris R. Cohen & Ernest Nagel: An Introduction to Logic and Scientific Method. first edition 1934 [As it was before Popper, Kuhn, Lakatos, Feyerabend et al]

2- Robert J. Ackermann: Modern Deductive Logic, Anchor Books 1970 ...only $1.45 for the First Edition :D

3- Irving M. Copi: Introduction to Logic....the classic now in 9th or 10th ed, 1st ed was 1953, I have the 5th from 1978.

[miss djax]

i really liked 'sophies world' by jostein gaardner

its a story of a young girl embroiled in a correspondance with a stranger. i wont give away the ending but the girl begins to question her reality, and a mystery is posed and framed around the history of philosophy.....its a great read, and covers just about every philosopher ever published....

it was one of the first times i ever saw spinoza synthesized so clearly and concisely.....i really loved the book...

miss djax

[Bluenose]

4- The Philosophy of History In our Time: an anthology selected w/ intro & commentary by Hans Meyerhoff 1959 Anchor Books

5- E. H. Carr: What IS History? 1961 Vintage

6- H. J. Muller: The Uses of the Past 1952 Mentor

7- Allan Nevins: The Gateway to History 1962 ed. Anchor

[jpbrooks]

I have mentioned this book (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0024199109/qid=1049002186/sr=1-14/ref=sr_1_14/104-6193146-3529510?v=glance&s=books) in this forum a few weeks ago as a good introductory Philosophy textbook.




As for websites, this online journal (http://examinedlifejournal.com/index.shtml) contains many interesting articles on a number of different philosophical topics that may be somewhat beyond the "introductory" level.


This site (http://www.philosophers.co.uk/) does contain "introductory" essays, but charges a small fee for full access to the site's archive. Having read a few of these essays, I would say that full access to this site is worth the price of the fee.

[King's Indian]

Hello,

I'll add this, so that us moral philosophy chaps don't sulk:
Utopias, Dolphins and Computers (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/stores/offering/list/-/0415133785/all/ref%3Dpd%5Fts%5Fba/104-1285915-4124746), by Mary Midgley. Very clear, with a dry sense of humour.

Derrida: perhaps his most clearly written stuff, for those who think "deconstruction" to be an acceptable synonym for "analysis"*. Of Grammatology (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/stores/offering/list/-/0801858305/all/ref=dp_pb_a/104-1285915-4124746). All the old faves: "speech/writing", "differance", although you end up learning about more about Rousseau's habits then strictly necessary.

Limited Inc (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/stores/detail/-/books/0810107872/104-1285915-4124746). I'll link to the reviews, if one doesn't believe the bit about clarity. Speech-Act Theory. Derrida vs. Searle. Guess who comes out the better?

KI.

*Although the etymology isn't too dissimilar, I grant you.

[Hugo Holbling]

KI,

What do you think of Kamuf's Derrida Reader (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0231066597/qid=1049091541/sr=1-2/ref=sr_1_2/002-3871484-1806464?v=glance&s=books)? It might be an alternative to including most of his individual works...

On another note, i think we need a Dictionary Of Philosophy. This one (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0140512500/qid=1049091887/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_1/002-3871484-1806464?v=glance&s=books), by Thomas Mautner, is probably the best for its size and cost. Also, i think the editor is related to the great Mautner of Worterbüch der Philosophie fame; perhaps the entries are based on that work?

[a8o]

Originally posted by mac_philo
I think this list is an excellent idea. I also think that we should include expensive and/or out of print books. People can use the library and the internet to locate rare materials. I highly doubt that the list will be overloaded with such texts.
Apologies for not providing URLs; I still use Lynx.
Epistemology/Scepticism:


Additionally, this is an excellent idea, but could we possibly separate or mark those hard-to-find of books from the rest of the main list.

[a8o]

Originally posted by miss djax
i really liked 'sophies world' by jostein gaardner

it was one of the first times i ever saw spinoza synthesized so clearly and concisely.....i really loved the book...

miss djax

It was one of the first times I read anything in relation to Philosophy. Call it my 'introduction' - when I read it, it took about 3 or 4 months. Hefty, for a twelve year old.

I also believe it should be on the list.

[a8o]

Additionally, I propose links made to the Gutenburg Archive for works eligible to be on there. Classical philosophers, for example.

I hope my posts have been of some value as I am just the sort of person such a list would benefit - schooling me as to just what study of philosophy includes and involves. I look forward to sourcing some of the texts when this booklist becomes an official thing.

[King's Indian]

Originally posted by Hugo Holbling
KI,

What do you think of Kamuf's Derrida Reader (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0231066597/qid=1049091541/sr=1-2/ref=sr_1_2/002-3871484-1806464?v=glance&s=books)? It might be an alternative to including most of his individual works...



Hi, Hugo.

If Peggy's Digest turns out to be the People's Choice, that's fine by me. As a matter of taste solely, I prefer to struggle through the whole book rather than whet my appetite with any type of reader, so by the time I got round to it I was glad that I knew some of the fun bits it passed over. I think there's still stuff you can't see anywhere else, mind, and it is a cheaper alternative. I'd still like "Limited Inc" in there, if poss. If we were talking about a real library, I'd donate a couple of copies from my own pocket.

As for philosophical dictionaries, again, I like ones that show some personality in selection and definition, a bit like Fowler's English Usage, or the old Oxford Companion to Music. I'd be grateful for your opinion as to which phil. dic. is the most fun to read, even if it can't be included in the booklist.

Take care,
KI.

[Hugo Holbling]

Originally posted by King's Indian
As a matter of taste solely, I prefer to struggle through the whole book rather than whet my appetite with any type of reader, so by the time I got round to it I was glad that I knew some of the fun bits it passed over.

Sure, but i'm thinking of anyone who might end up here asking "so what Derrida should i try?" In that case, i'd probably say "all of it", but that's of limited help, i guess. Instead i'd point in the direction of the reader for an introduction, or else a specific work, as you've done. I second the choice.

I'd be grateful for your opinion as to which phil. dic. is the most fun to read, even if it can't be included in the booklist.

I'd say Mautner's original German version is the best, but i always use Thomas Mautner's - linked to above. It's fun to read, especially his amusing remarks on some ideas, and easy enough to learn what you need. If i want any more depth i go to the work concerned, so a bigger dictionary isn't necessary. In any case, i often find history of philosophy works to be more helpful, once ol' Tom has sent me looking. :D

I have a friend in New Malden, btw. I've often queued for hours to get to the cinema down your way. :(

[King's Indian]

Hi, Hugo!

[...] "i'm thinking of anyone who might end up here asking "so what Derrida should i try?" In that case, i'd probably say "all of it" I embrace you as a brother.[...] "but that's of limited help, i guess" Hmmm. I don't suppose we're going to make any new friends by suggesting Glas for first crack out of the box.

Thomas Mautner, you say..? I owe you one. Can't really help you with cinema queues, though. I wonder if we have a mutual acquaintance. How strange.

Thank you,

KI.

[Hugo Holbling]

Originally posted by King's Indian
I embrace you as a brother.

You are well met, fellow adventurer.

Hmmm. I don't suppose we're going to make any new friends by suggesting Glas for first crack out of the box.

Or The Post Card. What do you make of the literature out there proposing to "explain" Derrida, or at least guide the reader through him initially? Critchley seems to have a fine understanding, while this book (http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/0415280109/qid=1049132430/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_2_1/026-8070240-8410036) comes highly recommended, apparently. I just got it today, so i'll see what comes of it. Do you have any suggestions for the reader who finds the first hurdle too daunting?

Thomas Mautner, you say..? I owe you one.

I like it, anyway. Every so often he slips in his own opinions or a quip, blatantly out-of-place in a dictionary. :D

Can't really help you with cinema queues, though. I wonder if we have a mutual acquaintance. How strange.

It's all down to Ikea, or so i'm told. However, once there was a girl at the bowling alley handing out the shoes who was so beautiful my friend and i sat and gawked at her for half an hour. :eek:

As for mutual acquaintances - i expect so. Do you know of anyone called Fitz or Petch? Common enough nicknames, i guess, but these two are legendary, especially if you are a connoisseur of literature or acts of low moral fibre...

[King's Indian]

Originally posted by Hugo Holbling
You are well met, fellow adventurer.



Or The Post Card. What do you make of the literature out there proposing to "explain" Derrida, or at least guide the reader through him initially? Critchley seems to have a fine understanding, while this book (http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/0415280109/qid=1049132430/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_2_1/026-8070240-8410036) comes highly recommended, apparently. I just got it today, so i'll see what comes of it. Do you have any suggestions for the reader who finds the first hurdle too daunting?


Hugo, mon semblable!

Haven't read that one ,but I trust the name of Christopher Norris on sight. In fact, he wrote the book on Derrida that was part of the "Modern Masters" series published by Fontana, the first book I ever read about the bloke; I was piqued by a fine-arts student's mention of how her nude calendar project would deconstruct the uses of erotic photography, or some such. So I did what one did do before the internet: asked the chap at Waterstones (I mean, back in the days when they were frighteningly clever). I remember the feeling of quiet acceptance as I closed the book: I always knew she was talking bollocks.
Anyway, there's that, and "What's Wrong with Post-modernism", and a book on Paul de Man that would be up your alley, if you like the book you've got. Haven't read Critchley, so I can't say. Rodolphe Gasche has some stuff about JD, and he sticks to the philosophical aspects. Bit of a trudge, though.

As for advice to the philosophy tyro: don't be put off by the assumption that you're as familiar with the citations that JD is. As part of his strategy is close reading, he always quotes generously and judiciously, so you do end up learning something. Again, if there's a bit that seems too rich, mark it and come back later. He's never so playful that he doesn't have some point. This may be more clear later on. Always look for the core of common-sense: there's always a way to rephrase his most interesting ideas in everyday terms: even for me.
I would issue a word of warning, and that is: be careful.

Ikea? I discard Ikea. Prudence forbids my asking the outcome of l'affaire bowling-alley...

As to your chums...sorry: not a sausage, and yet I am the intersection of both sets you mention. I suspect New Malden yet awaits its Edith Wharton, someone fully capable of cataloguing and dissecting its rigid social strata. I shall keep an ear cocked for the names, though.

Take care,

KI.

[Bluenose]

8- Wilhelm Windelbrand: A History of Philosophy, James H. Tufts translation, first ed. 1893. 2nd ed of 1901 is in 2 soft cover vol from Harper Torchbooks 1958.

9- Bertrand Russell: A History of Western Philosophy, Simon and Schuster 1945, softcover Touchstone Books.

10- Abraham Kaplan: The New World of Philosophy, Vintage Books edition 1963

11- Frederick Coppleston, S.J. A Hist of Phil, The Newman Press (9 hardback vol in the 1960s and 70s) is also in 17 paperbacks from Doubleday Image Books

12- A. J. Ayer: Phil in the 20th Century 1982, softcover Vintage 1984 [intended as sequel to #9]

13- The Columbia Hist. of West. Phil. 1999 Ed by Richard H. Popkin....."gives equal attention to both...continental and analytic schools..."

[Bluenose]

14- Edgar S. Brightman: A Phil of Rel, Prentice-Hall 1940

15- David E. Trueblood: Phil of Rel, Harper & Row 1957

[Bluenose]

16- The Basic Writings of Bertrand Russell 1903-1959 ed. by Egner & Denonn c. 1961 another Touchstone softcover

17- American Phil. in the 20th Cent. [ed w/ Intro survey, biographical notes and bibliographies by Paul Kurtz] Macmillan 1966

18- Phil in the 20th Cent, Ed w/ Intros : Wm Barrett & H. D. Aiken, Random House 1962.
Four volumes with only slight overlap w/ Kurtz......

[Bluenose]

Reference
19- A Dictionary of Phil, ed Anthony Flew: Gramercy 1999

20- Masterpieces of World Phil, ed: Frank Magill, Harper Collins 1990

21- The Great Ideas, A Syntopicon of the Great Books of the Western World 1952 [Vol 2&3 of the 54 vol GBWW, found in many libraries]

Chronological Context = PURE reference
22- The Timetables of History [Bernard Grun based on Werner Stein's Kulturfahrplan] first Touchstone edition 1979

Broad context Survey of Phil
23- Daniel Boorstin: The Seekers, Random House 1998
[Phil-Rel-Science-History-Lit]

24- Bertrand Russell: Wisdom of the West [ed: Paul Foulkes] Doubleday 1959 [Hist of Phil in social and political setting]
Would you believe, a coffee table size book of 313 pages with pictures, diagrams or maps on EVERY page :D

[Pyrrho]

I like The Ethics of Belief, edited by A.J. Burger, ISBN 1-931333-07-6:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1931333076/

It is inexpensive, and contains three essays, two of which are quite famous, William Kingdon Clifford's The Ethics of Belief and William James' The Will to Believe. Many people who believe they have read these essays have really only read abridged versions; this book has the complete essays.

There are currently a couple of threads that deal specifically with the essays in this book.

And what better place is there to start philosophy than with the question of when it is appropriate to believe something?

http://images.amazon.com/images/P/1931333076.01.LZZZZZZZ.jpg

[RED DAVE]

Many of the basic texts of philosophy can be found, free, online.


E-Texts of Philosophy (http://www.epistemelinks.com/Main/MainText.aspx)

RED DAVE

[Philosoft]

Okay, I guess it's time to start compiling. Many thanks to those of you who contributed. I'm not yet entirely sure what my criteria will be for including a suggested book in the list, so look for a rough-draft list in a few days, to be possibly up for debate or poll.

~Philosoft

[Hugo Holbling]

Originally posted by Philosoft:
Okay, I guess it's time to start compiling.

I think there will be some gaps and i'm surprised by the lack of participation in this idea. Nevertheless, will you allow additional recommendations to be sent to you via PM if and when we have any?

[Philosoft]

Absolutely, Hugo. I'm new at this list compiling, so there are no hard-and-fast rules yet. Like I said, I'll put up a rough-draft for final comments.

~Philo

[the_cave]

13- The Columbia Hist. of West. Phil. 1999 Ed by Richard H. Popkin....."gives equal attention to both...continental and analytic schools..."

Oh, yeah, I forgot about this one--and I even own it! Probably the best single-volume history out there. I'd be taking this one to the desert island.

[Cretinist]

I definitely favor the idea of putting overview books on the list.

Matter and Consciousness - Revised Edition: A Contemporary Introduction to the Philosophy of Mind (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0262530740/internetinfidelsA/) by Paul M. Churchland. The name speaks for itself.

Oriental Philosophies (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/002365810X/internetinfidelsA/) by John M. Koller. This is an overall introduction to Asian philosophy and its history.

A History of Western Philosophy (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0671201581/internetinfidelsA/) by Bertrand Russell. As long as the section on modern philosophy is taken with a large grain a salt, this is a great introduction.

Atheism: A Philosophical Justification (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0877229430/internetinfidelsA/) by Michael Martin. While this may be more appropriate on a EOG booklist, it certainly has a lot of relevance to the arguments that may come up in this forum with theists. Would a technical discussion on the Ontological Argument belong here or in EOG?

Masterpieces of World Philosophy: Nearly 100 Classics of the World's Greatest Philosophers Analyzed and Explained (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0062700510/internetinfidelsA/) by John Roth and Frank N. Magill. Another self-explanatory book. This book covers both Western and Eastern philosophy books, even up to contemporary philosophy. A definite must have.

The Oxford Campion to Philosophy (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0198661320/internetinfidelsA/) by Ted Honderich. This is a great dictionary/encyclopedia of philosophical terms and names. It can also be found online at www.xrefer.com (http://www.xrefer.com).

[Thomas Ash]

Hi everyone!

I just thought I'd add my reading list for Cambridge University, where I'm doing Philosophy as a single subject soon. I've actually only just got this, as I flew back from 3 months of volunteer teaching in Ghana yesterday (in time for my birthday today, and getting to see all my family and friends! :D ) So I'll add comments where I've read the books, but mostly I haven't read them:


Russel, B - Problems of Philosophy
Nagel, T - What Does It All Mean? (this seemed quite good.)
Blackburn, SW - Think (this was very good generally, but I though the ethics chapter was a bit of a let down.)
Descartes, R - Meditations (I've read a bit of this, and it seems like a must for any philosophy reading list.)
Mill, JS - Utilitarianism (I read this too, and I think it's a good idea for the list.)
Warnock, GJ - Contemporary Moral Philosophy
Williams, BAO - Morality (I wasn't very keen on this)
Guttenplan, S - Languages of Logic
Hodges, W - Logic
Campbell, K - Body and Mind
Carruthers, P - Introducing Persons
Smith, P + Jones, OR - The Philosophy of Mind


There you go! But from my independent reading, I think I'd suggest these top 3 too:


Hume, D - Enquiry Concerning Human Understaning (and for this list, probably Dialogues Concerning Natural Religion too.)
Mackie, JL - The Miracle of Theism: Arguments For and Against the Existence of God (this is really good... and most importantly for this board he comes out against!)
Macquarrie, J + Childress, J - A New Dictionary of Christian Ethics (this actually has some excellent entries on all aspects of morality, secular and religious, by leading philosophers.)


What do people think of these?

Best wishes,

Thomas

[dublczek]

Are you recommending books to each other or to us laymen? Scoot. You've had your say. :D

Now I know what "thanks for all the fish" really meant.

Thanks for the list, folks.

(I think this is a plot to get non-philosophers into reading and away from posting needlessly. Selfish, selfish, selfish... :p)

[Bluenose]

Originally posted by Hugo Holbling
.... the subject at hand. ... to develop a list of books or articles that could make up a potential reading list for the philosophy forum.

... to help Bill and Philosoft decide what should end up on the list; something of this kind needs to be done in order to avoid the list being unmanageably large and therefore superfluous.
:)

[dublczek]

Ooops. :o

I followed a thread to get here and didn't see that. That thread was talking about laymen not paying attention. I guess the poster meant someone like me. :(

Sorry, and thanks.

[King's Indian]

Blackburn, SW - Think (this was very good generally, but I though the ethics chapter was a bit of a let down.)


Hello, Thomas!

Funny you should say that. Did you happen to glance at his follow-up, "Being Good"? It's alright, but it's a bit slim, and I'm loath to recommend it solely because of my slavish devotion to Midgley. More room for her.
Perhaps he skimped in "Think" so he could squeeze another book out? 162 pages inc. biblio. and index isn't exactly a hard day at the coal-face.

Take care,

KI.

PS. While I’m here: Evolution as a Religion ( http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0416396607/002-5853506-5965611?vi=glance)- How bad science rests on even worse philosophy.
Beast and Man (http://www.google.com/search?as_q=midgley&num=100&hl=en&ie=ISO-8859-1&btnG=Google+Search&as_epq=Beast+and+Man&as_oq=&as_eq=&lr=&as_ft=i&as_filetype=&as_qdr=all&as_occt=any&as_dt=i&as_sitesearch=&safe=images)-Man in nature

[Defiant Heretic]

This (http://www.ibiblio.org/gutenberg/cgi-bin/sdb/cat.cgi/cat.cgi) is the index page of Project Gutenberg. You can find any book they have by searching by the author's name.

Only books on which the copyright has expired will be there, sadly, but that shouldn't be a huge problem in this topic.

[Bluenose]

Originally posted by Cretinist

Masterpieces of World Philosophy: Nearly 100 Classics of the World's Greatest Philosophers Analyzed and Explained (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0062700510/internetinfidelsA/) by John Roth and Frank N. Magill. Another self-explanatory book. This book covers both Western and Eastern philosophy books, even up to contemporary philosophy. A definite must have.

The Oxford Companion to Philosophy (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0198661320/internetinfidelsA/) by Ted Honderich. This is a great dictionary/encyclopedia of philosophical terms and names. It can also be found online at www.xrefer.com (http://www.xrefer.com).

Two of the most user friendly references... :cool:

[Unbeliever]

Here is a very good introductory book on what is involved in actually doing philosophy:

Doing Philosophy: An Introduction Through Thought Experiments (http://mcgraw-hill.co.uk/html/0767420500.html)

This book covers the whole gamut of philosophical subjects, in an easy to read, non-technical manner.:)

[Unbeliever]

Here is a very good introductory book on what is involved in actually doing philosophy:

Doing Philosophy: An Introduction Through Thought Experiments (http://mcgraw-hill.co.uk/html/0767420500.html), Theodore Schick, Lewis Vaughn

This book covers the whole gamut of philosophical subjects, in an easy to read, non-technical manner.:)

[Pyrrho]

The Plato Cult and Other Philosophical Follies by David Stove:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0631177094/

It is a book that many "philosophers" desperately need to read.

[Philosoft]

Hey gang, just an update. I am still working on the list; right now I'm in the process of rebuilding the Amazon links so that they contain the Infidels code thingy. I'll be busy this weekend, so I hope to have something up by next week.

~Philo

[Bluenose]

Originally posted by Philosoft
Hey gang, just an update. I am still working on the list; right now I'm in the process of rebuilding the Amazon links so that they contain the Infidels code thingy. I'll be busy this weekend, so I hope to have something up by next week.

~Philo

Hi Philo,
II has been around for ages w/o a PHIL LIST, so take as long as you need :D

Another valuable online resource is www.philosophypages.com
which has bios, dictionary with links and biblio, history et cet.

Also a study guide which should be good for the newer scholars.

[thefugitivesaint]

hey Hugo,
I just finished Christian Delacampagne's book and i have a few reservations concerning his treatment of his subject. Don't you find it strange that he doesn't address Feminism in any detail especially given his overview concerning the myriad opinions on "Rationalism" and Logic? What about the philosophical takes on gender and sexuality, power structures and how that relates to ethics, subjective perspectives, and values in general?

I thought the book was good for what it concerned itself with but its shortsighted to think that 20th century philosophy was primarily male oriented and directed. Even a passing mention of people like simon de beauvoir during a discussion of existentialism would have been nice.

Just my 2 cents.
-theSaint

[Thomas Ash]

Originally posted by King's Indian
Hello, Thomas!

Funny you should say that. Did you happen to glance at his follow-up, "Being Good"? It's alright, but it's a bit slim, and I'm loath to recommend it solely because of my slavish devotion to Midgley. More room for her.
Perhaps he skimped in "Think" so he could squeeze another book out? 162 pages inc. biblio. and index isn't exactly a hard day at the coal-face.

Take care,

KI.

Hello King's Indian,

I've actually just got Being Good, so I'll let you know what I think of it as soon as I read it. 162 pages is very thin (especially when you consider it's in tiny, pocket book format - a little smaller than A5), and I think the books - both of them - are very much intended as short introductions for the general public, which is in a way why I recommended Think. But with the ethics chapter, I thought it was more a case of his whole approach being wrong, which is always a risk with ethics books. He didn't seek to justify ethics, or really compare the merits of and arguments for traditional ethical systems in any way, and focussed solely on cognitivism/non-cognitivism. :rolleyes: Hmm... why did I buy Being Good again?

Best wishes,

Thomas

---
For interesting (hopefully! ;)) essays on atheism and various religions, check out my website: Atheist Ground (http://www.bigissueground.com/atheistground/index.shtml).

[Hugo Holbling]

Originally posted by thefugitivesaint
hey Hugo,
I just finished Christian Delacampagne's book and i have a few reservations concerning his treatment of his subject. Don't you find it strange that he doesn't address Feminism in any detail especially given his overview concerning the myriad opinions on "Rationalism" and Logic?

Hey, Saint.

I'm in Switzerland at the moment so i can't say much for now (you wouldn't believe how much this connection is costing me...), but you're on the money. It's a shame he didn't expand his work to take in more thinkers, but i guess he had to exclude some aspects and decided the women had to go. :D I'd have liked to have seen his treatment of Kristeva, at any rate.

Nevertheless, i enjoyed his examination of philosophers from the prespective of the milieu and events they lived through. His coverage of Heidegger was brutal in this respect, i think.

I'll discuss this with you some more later on, when i'm back, but for now i'm glad you read it. :) Back to Feyerabend for me now: the master. :D

[Tara]

Originally posted by Philosoft
Hey gang, just an update. I am still working on the list; right now I'm in the process of rebuilding the Amazon links so that they contain the Infidels code thingy. I'll be busy this weekend, so I hope to have something up by next week.

~Philo

hey, is the list going up this week?… I need to be educated.

btw, is anyone familiar with "A Short History of Modern Philosophy" (http://www.rogerscruton.com/books/short_history.html) By Roger Scruton?
I happen to have a copy, have read no philosophy before, and am wondering if it's a decent (but obviously very brief) intro... Or should I find an intro a bit more substantial?

[Bluenose]

21- The Great Ideas, A Syntopicon of the Great Books of the Western World 1952 [Vol 2&3 of the 54 vol GBWW, found in many libraries]

I just found a website listing the contents of the second edition of the GBWW from 1990 in 60 volumes, though the site author had never seen them and had only found the info in online library sites.

I mention this because I have never seen or heard of the 2nd ed until now. The first 53 volumes seem to cover the original set with extra authors like Twain and Dickens, etc. New Vol 53 seems to be same as old vol 54 [Freud] with seven vol of 20th Century authors. Many of the additional authors are also in the 10 Vol set "Gateway to the Great Books" or the annuals called "The Great Ideas Today".

It appears there are a couple different websites with links to almost all of the authors from the old GBWW series.

l

[Bluenose]

Originally posted by Thomas Ash
... essays on atheism and various religions, check out my website: Atheist Ground (http://www.bigissueground.com/atheistground/index.shtml).

BTW how is the List coming ?

[Bluenose]

Too many people put too much effort into this thread to let it slide off the first index page :D

[Philosoft]

Hey gang, I'm having to redo the Amazon links so that they have the correct Infidels tag on them. Bear with me.

~Philo

[Thomas Ash]

Originally posted by Bluenose
BTW how is the List coming ?

Hi BlueNose - thanks for the complement! :D
What did you mean by "the List", by the way? Or was that directed at the person who's putting together this philosophy forum booklist? :confused:

Best wishes,

Thomas Ash

[Bluenose]

Originally posted by Thomas Ash
Hi BlueNose [1]
- thanks for the complement! :D [2]
What did you mean by "the List", by the way? [3]
Or was that directed at the person [4]
who's putting together this philosophy forum booklist? :confused:

Best wishes,

Thomas Ash

1- Bluenose is one word [although I have seen usage of the variant spelling for the dime, stamp or ship depected thereon]
2- Treasure it, it's geniune. :D
3- The subject of this thread.
4- Yes, Philosoft

If Hegel said "the essence of truth is qualification", I have never seen it in any book of quotations. So, IF anyone has read enough Hegel and remembers that quote, please tell me where, other than the collected works ;)

Now that was a long bump :eek:

[Bluenose]

Authors
Titles
Subjects.............

Anyone?

Ferris........ Ferris Buehler? :rolleyes:

[Bill Snedden]

I just thought of a couple more that might be worth adding. Not introductory texts, but interesting nonetheless...

Moral Philosophy: The Sovereignty of Good (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0415253993/) by Iris Murdoch.

Murdoch's take on moral realism is interesting and, while not wholly unique, certainly uniquely presented (at least in my admittedly limited experience). I'm currently reading this and while it's not the easiest read, Murdoch offers an emotionally compelling argument.

Epistemology: Warrant: the Current Debate (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0195078624/qid=1054148769/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_1/104-5683021-6708734?v=glance&s=books) and Warrant and Proper Function (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0195078640/ref=pd_bxgy_text_1/104-5683021-6708734?v=glance&s=books&st=*) by Alvin Plantinga.

To anyone interested in foundationalist approaches to epistemology, these works are well-nigh indispensable. The first is a "summary" of the current status of epistemic warrant in academic philsophy. The second is the current "last word" in a theory of "knowledge" as "justified true belief". Although not completely satisfactory in all aspects, including a rather lame "disproof" of evolutionary naturalism in the W&PF, Plantinga has a lot to say and says it well. (Note, I've begun, but not finished Warrant: the Current Debate and have not yet read the other although I've read parts of it, so take my recommendation with a grain of salt.)

Philosophy of Religion: The Evidential Argument from Evil (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0253210283/qid=1054149173/sr=1-8/ref=sr_1_8/104-5683021-6708734?v=glance&s=books) edited by Daniel Howard-Snyder

Jeff Lowder's review on Amazon says it all and you can read it on the above-linked page.

That's all for now!

Regards,

Bill Snedden

[Bluenose]

I predict the list will be ready in less than:
a day,
a week,
a month, ORRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR

a year :D

[Philosoft]

Oh, loyal denizens of Philosophy, I must beg your continued patience. I have the list mostly compiled, yet I have not been able to redo all the Amazon links to make them II-friendly. Our summer training has started and I'm in the home stretch of my job. As I transition back to school, I should find the time to knock it out. Weeks, a month perhaps.

Grazie,
Philo

[Bluenose]

OK ;)

[luvluv]

The overview which got me over the hump was the Idiots Guide to Philsophy. I don't usually read those books but this one was by Tom Morris, a theist and a pretty bright guy. It's fairly comprehensive but not too low brow.

[Philosoft]

I just gave my employer my two weeks notice. Home stretch for the booklist, and all that.

[luvluv]

Now that's commitment.

[Bluenose]

Originally posted by Bluenose
I predict the list will be ready in less than:
a day,
a week,
a month, ORRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR

a year :D

Well, here we are one month later :D

See what happens when I make predictions ;)

[Bluenose]

Originally posted by luvluv
Now that's commitment.

Hi luvluv, I think we discussed logic on both page 1 & 2 ??

I'm too tired to look:D

[Bluenose]

Originally posted by Bluenose
Too many people put too much effort into this thread to let it slide off the first index page :D


:boohoo:

[xorbie]

For shame :( ... but yeah, how is that coming along?

[Unbeliever]

Originally posted by Bluenose
Well, here we are one month later :D

See what happens when I make predictions ;)
Yeah, you could be a Psychic Friend, or perhaps a high level member of the current executive branch regime! :rolleyes:

[Bluenose]

Originally posted by jpbrooks
A Philosophy booklist seems like a good idea as long as the books are not very expensive.

Sorry JP,
I forgot to comment on SSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSs

ONE: Chicago has some BIG libraries, and part of the point of having a list is to speed selection at the library.

TWO: If a good book is not at your library, try interlibrary loan.

THREE: Chicago, NYC, San Francisco [to mention 3 places I have seen them ] and many college towns have an old money saving idea called USED BOOK STORES, but not the podunk I live in at the moment.

FOUR: No, I am not going to loan any of youall any of my books and I am not going to ask to borrow any of yours :D

[Peter Kirby]

This is mandatory reading for anyone wanting to know what they mean by "free will" and why the subject is important yet so confused.

Daniel C. Dennett, Elbow room : the varieties of free will worth wanting (MIT Press, 1984)

Also very worthwhile for arguing against "if you are just matter in motion, you don't have free will, and you cannot truly think."

best,
Peter Kirby

[Philosoft]

I guess you guys probably want me to get my lazy ass back to work on this thing? Okay, point taken.

[Bluenose]

Originally posted by Philosoft
I guess you guys probably want me to get my lazy ass back to work on this thing? Okay, point taken.

Congratulations on your moderatorship, and I will not say a word on this fine event about the LIST....

OK, just a few words:

Rome was not built in a day, all good things take time, patience is a virtue, cliches save time...... :banghead:

[Bluenose]

ONE: Chicago has some BIG libraries, and part of the point of having a list is to speed selection at the library.

While at my perpetual cull and sort magazine articles task, I found out today about the 'new' [opened in 91] main Chicago public library in an article in the Aug 92 Atlantic.

The $144 million , 756,000 sq ft 10 story building is the largest municipal library in the USA and second largest public library in the world [after the British Library in London].

That was as of 1992 so the $200 million LA project or another new building may be as big or bigger but the point remains the same: big cities have big libraries. :D

[Tuvan]

Friedrich Nietzsche - "Beyond Good and Evil"

[Luiseach]

I don't know if it has been mentioned yet, but if it hasn't, then I would suggest philo (http://www.philoonline.org) as an especially interesting philosophical journal.

[DoubleDutchy]

Originally posted by Tuvan
Friedrich Nietzsche - "Beyond Good and Evil" :notworthy
+ Human all too human.

[Tyler Durden]

Originally posted by DoubleDutchy
:notworthy
+ Human all too human.

What, and neglect the Gay Science? :eek: Fer crying outloud!!

A sample no self-respecting philosopher of theothanatology is ignorant of:

"New Struggles. After Buddha was dead people showed his shadow for centuries afterwards in a cave - an immense frightful shadow. God is dead: but as the human race is constituted, there will perhaps be caves for millenniums yet, in which people will show his shadow. And we - we have still to overcome his shadow!"

[Bluenose]

Originally posted by Unbeliever
Yeah, you could be a Psychic Friend, or perhaps a high level member of the current executive branch regime! :rolleyes:

Stay tuned Booklist fans, there could be more fun and humour
in the next day, week, month or whenever.....:D ;)