I've seen it all now.

[Solus]

A guy that rejects evolution on another board I visit has recently said some astounding things on another subject - physics. I thought you guys might get a kick out of this:

[stellar evolution] Is a load... gasses don't create their own gravity.

Gas in outer space cannot create enough mutual gravity to 'clump' together. I've never seen 'balls' of fog. Gas freefloating in a vacuum cannot 'push itself' together to create a star. Gas clouds in outer space expand... they do not contract.

Here is the usual stuff from him:
God can/is proven: Complexity exist and complexity does not come from chaos (and as long as Entropy remains a convienient, unproven, unseen, vague theory it will not matter).

He is just so stupid that sometimes I don't even know how to respond. It's not like there is a safe starting point in his understanding from where to start.

[Arken]

That's nothing, a regular to the DALnet IRC channel #Atheism used to have a website in which he tried to explain the origins of the universe in a way that tied it in with Ayn Rand's Objectivism (and completely threw out the big bang) I wish I had a mirror of it, but in essence (it was probably a total of 50 pages of babble) he was saying that the universe existed because it willed itself to.

[sakrilege]

If gases don't 'have gravity' then what keeps the atmosphere on earth? Why does the air get thinner at higher altitudes?

Balls of fog?? What are clouds then?

I know, I'm preaching to the choir, sorry. :p

[nermal]

Not to nit pick, but while clouds are indeed balls of fog, it ain't gravity that holds them together. But that raises an interesting question: Just what is it that holds clouds together? Cohesion? Would the cohesion of the water vapor be sufficiently strong to hold a cloud together? Hmmm....

Ed

[Infidelettante]

It still amazes me that the Fundies never learn. In the early 70s when I was in Bible college one professor said the same thing using the example of smoke. 'Do you ever see smoke gathering together in balls?' I just sat there dumbfounded. It took four more years before I could admit to myself that it was all a load of crap.

[Solus]

Well, I don't think he's a christian fundamentalist. He holds some strange ideas about god that he has formed on his own, but he won't elaborate exactly what they are. He seems to believe in a strange brand of pantheism(?) perhaps.

Anyway, he is incredibly annoying. He certainly uses fundy tactics. He will assert that order can't arise from disorder. I ask him to prove it, but no matter what examples I can think of or evidence I present he will repeat it and just say it's common sense. ARGH.

[WinAce]

Can I have a link to his best posts for my webpage (http://users.rcn.com/rostmd/winace/fundies/fstdt.htm)? </shameless plug>

[Solus]

He is IrishCherokee and this point came up later in this thread: http://www.ricecopforums.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=16810

[pmurray]

Originally posted by nermal
But that raises an interesting question: Just what is it that holds clouds together? Cohesion? Would the cohesion of the water vapor be sufficiently strong to hold a cloud together?

Ever seen a time-lapse film of a cloud over a hill? A cloud is not some particular group of droplets being "held together". Rather, it is a region in the atmosphere where water vapour will condense into droplets. It is no more a thing sitting there than is a stationary ripple in a stream.

[EGGO]

Originally posted by WinAce
Can I have a link to his best posts for my webpage (http://users.rcn.com/rostmd/winace/fundies/fstdt.htm)? </shameless plug>

Oh man, WinAce, if you liked some of those, you should take some of these.

The guy to look for is MasterJosh

If you look at this http://tp.krazesolutions.com/hm/index.php?showtopic=2557&st=30

You will hear him say 3) Well the firmament as proposed by one creationist could have been a layer of ice above the earth atmosphere. This would have increased air pressure and filtered out harmful rays from the son which could explain why Adam lived to be 900+ . This ice melting well could have cause it to rain.

[NZAmoeba]

Just to quickly add, clouds are formed because water molecules are attracted to other water molecules due to polar forces. Each molecule has a positive and negative end, which attracts the negative and positive ends of other molecules. Thats why a drop of water hanging underneith something doesn't fall, it would rarther defy gravity than leave the other water molecules.

But water does all sorts of crazy things anyway because of that, and it has no basis in sun forming nebulae.

And I don't think these guys understand the sheer scale of nebula... smoke from a cig won't have any noticeable gravity the same way a rock doesn't. Yet we cling to a BIG rock called earth despite the fact that it hurtles through the galaxy at incomprehenceable speeds. A cloud the size of solar systems will have a much greater gravitational strengh.

[Lobstrosity]

Originally posted by EGGO
Oh man, WinAce, if you liked some of those, you should take some of these.

The guy to look for is MasterJosh

If you look at this http://tp.krazesolutions.com/hm/index.php?showtopic=2557&st=30

You will hear him say 3) Well the firmament as proposed by one creationist could have been a layer of ice above the earth atmosphere. This would have increased air pressure and filtered out harmful rays from the son which could explain why Adam lived to be 900+ . This ice melting well could have cause it to rain.
Hmm, I assume by "harmful rays" he meant all rays, of which harmful would be a subset? It's not like sunlight readily passes through ice of any appreciable thickness :banghead: Man, this is certainly registering a high score on the stupidometer.