evolution vs. creationism

[dayton]

I am requesting a formal debate between evolution and creationism with a young-earth creationist. This topic would cover [the evidence for] evolution and abiogenesis, and the creationist position from a scienitifc, not theological or biblical, viewpoint. In other words, no using the bible to prove that the bible is right.


Dayton

[Doubting Didymus]

I can't personally think of any creationists currently posting that would likely be interested in a debate of this description.

[dayton]

What about Magus55 or Mike(ATL)? They seem to be educated creationists.

[Doubting Didymus]

From what I've seen of Magus, he's sensibly disinterested in the science behind creationism. Creationism is a religious faith, not a science in any meaningful way, and Magus seems to know this as well as anyone.

If Mike(ATL) is interested in creation and evolution, I have seen suprisingly little of him in the creation and evolution forum.

If you do manage to find one, I wish good luck in your debate. We could do with more E/C in the FD forum. Happy hunting.

[Silent Dave]

I think an evo-cre debate would be splendid -- particularly with a high-profile creationist debater. I suggest some subtle hints in our own E/C forum, as well as in other, less friendly sites, perhaps. Who knows? Maybe Sarfati will even find the gumbo to take someone on.


Dave

(Edited to correct appropriate yet mistaken spelling of "Sarfati" ~SD)

[dayton]

Still no takers?


Dayton

[KnightWhoSaysNi]

Originally posted by Wings
Still no takers?


Dayton

Hi Dayton,

It could be the case that the YEC posters in the forum don't look here in FD(CS) too often, so perhaps they're simply unaware of your challenge. Perhaps what you could do is send private messages to potential opponents (bringing your challenge to their attention), or perhaps subtly mention your challenge while making a post in E/C from time to time.

If you're involved in other fora besides II, perhaps you could mention your challenge and invite YEC's from there to debate you here at II too.

Jason

[rlogan]

Well I echo the interest in Sarfati.

Is he on this site? I had heard he was over at TWEB, and have been given a name there in a PM. Not sure if its OK to reveal such things.

[Doubting Didymus]

It's my understanding that Sarfati is aware of this site, but declines to participate. That's the polite translation, in any case.

[Bill Snedden]

Originally posted by Doubting Didymus
It's my understanding that Sarfati is aware of this site, but declines to participate. That's the polite translation, in any case.

From what I've seen on TWeb, Sarfati is indeed aware of this site and it's actually in our best interests that he stay away. His demeanor is almost constantly misanthropic and downright nasty. Whatever the quality of his arguments, he doesn't appear to be able to present them in a civil manner and we certainly don't need any of that here.

[Dargo]

Have we ever had any creationists on this site who weren't scientifically ignorant? Somebody who is only going to copy stuff from Christian web sites and quote the Bible isn't going to provide for an interesting debate I'm afraid. Maybe you should ask around some Christian forums. Good luck finding an interesting opponet.

[dayton]

I have sent a PM to theophilus, and if he is interested then hopefully we will have a debate. I apologize for drawing out this thread for so long.

Dayton

[lpetrich]

Evolution vs. creationism is a rather large subject. One ought to choose some subtopic, like:

Is homology a meaningful concept? Some creationists are known for claiming that certain well-known homologies aren't, like claiming that the human coccyx is not a vestigial tail. And attributing some homology to "common design" will be considered equivalent to accepting its reality.

Can the animals aboard Noah's Ark become distributed to all the continents in some reasonable way?

Is Noah's legendary voyage feasible?

Is radioisotope dating reliable?

Do four-winged flies and flies with legs growing on their heads tell us anything about the evolution of fly appendages? That legs-growing-on-heads bit is the effect of the Antennapedia and Proboscipedia mutations.

Is it possible for honeybees to have evolved their irreducibly-complex society?

Are mitochondria and chloroplasts the results of endosymbiosis?

Miracles will be considered an explain-anything hypothesis, and will be scored as a weakness.