just needed to vent

[KitKit]

ok, i am SO sick of this comment (or ones just like it), which is the typical response i get when people find out i am atheist...

"how can you see that sunset or look at your kids & not believe in god?"

are you fucking kidding? they are kidding right? that's my instant reaction to that comment.

the response in my head is... "the sunset has nothing to do with god! it has to do with a huge ball of fire out in the solar system that shines through the particles in the atmosphere & make a 'pretty' color in the sky. and the fact that you percieve the color that is made as 'pretty' is also scientific & the fact that i have 2 healthy, smart children REALLY has NOTHING to do with god! it has to do with ME & my husband & the fact that we take good care of our kids & we feed them right & we teach them things. don't you dare give the credit for my wonderful children to some fictional being. that is an insult to my husband & i. i refuse to share the credit with anyone else!"

but for some reason i dont' say that to them. i kinda freeze up & just let it go. i have no idea why. i am jsut hoping they will go away i guess. or maybe i think they are a waste of time. who knows.

[CheeseheadHeathen]

I like:

"How can you look at children raped by priests, guys flying into buildings, people starving in Africa, girl babies left to die of exposure in China, people sleeping in boxes in your own home town, and still believe in god?"

But I agree with you that it's a waste of time. You're not going to change their minds, they're not going to change yours, and changing people's minds isn't necessarily a laudable goal anyway.

[orpheus last chant]

Oh. no, the "lookie lookie a pretty flower" argument for God. One of my "most hated" too. If I'm feeling confident, I reply by "Hey, how can you look at the 5 o'clock news/natural disasters/viruses/.etc. and believe in a benevolent God?

If, I'm even more confident, I give a small lecture of subjective values and how everybody, including atheists use'em.
:p Just to show'em they're in dire need of a dictionary.

If the person is reasonable, both, nicely.

If I'm pissed: "See this (middle finger)! Do you believe I mean it? How could you contemplate my facial expression and not believe it?"

Neah.... I don't have the guts...
:D

[MrFrosty]

Originally posted by KitKit
ok, i am SO sick of this comment (or ones just like it), which is the typical response i get when people find out i am atheist...

"how can you see that sunset or look at your kids & not believe in god?"

Sounds like pure 100% unadulterated superstitious retarded BS on a par with what early Man would have come up with. So sad to think that we live in the 21st century yet be faced with such ridiculous comments.

[variant 13]

I've always liked this one:

It's basically saying:

"I'm completely ignorant of the world around me so I'm going to believe in a giant voodoo monkey god that lives in the sky."

[fando]

"how can you see that sunset or look at your kids & not believe in god?"

I get this one on a regular basis. As an Astronomy buff, I sometimes share my telescope observations with random people that walk by. Eventually, after gawking at Jupiter or Mars, people will make comments on how the glory of god has been revealed to them and so on and so forth. I usually leave them be, but sometimes I get prodded, and usually I reveal my atheism. Some people become silent as they struggle to digest this new info, but others persist in prodding and make dumb arguments like that quote. If there's an akward moment, I usually recover by directing their attention elsewhere, like "Here's a galaxy, want to see?"

[Queen of Swords]

I'd probably say something blasphemous like, "How can you look at your kids and not think of sex? Sex made them, didn't it?"

[MJones]

I've got two wonderful children too.

My wife has trouble getting pregnant naturally. For both kids, she had to get a series of shots to make her ovulate, and then we had to do an IUI (Inner Uterine Injection).

We monitored the pregnancies carefully. We made sure she was getting the right nutrition and doing everything for the health of each baby. We had periodic ultra-sounds done to make sure everything was progressing correctly.

The first one was breach. We found that out when the doctor could not find a heartbeat. An ultra-sound confirmed that she was, indeed, breach. Two days later the c-section was performed.

The second one turned ok. But my wife's cervix did not dilate, so another c-section was performed.

Both kids were born with underformed hips, and spent their first few months in correction harnesses. The girl had to be put in a body cast. X-Ray confirm that the cast and harnesses did their job, as the hips have formed normally. Both are doing well now, and walk and run as if neither had any trouble.

Yeah.... THANK GOD FOR MY TWO CHILDREN! :rolleyes: None of this science played any role! :banghead:

Dirty Dog

[athee]

Originally posted by Dirty Dog


Yeah.... THANK GOD FOR MY TWO CHILDREN! :rolleyes: None of this science played any role! :banghead:

Dirty Dog

-sarcasm- well if you reaaaaaly opened your eyes, you'd see that it was God that let us have the science/knowledge to be used to save your kids. So yes, thank gawd!!!!

... I think I'm gonna throw up now after typing that drivel.

as a "science/religion" sidenote, I went to engineering school with a catholic. I asked him about gawd/dinosaurs, and he said the fossils were placed there as a trick to see if we are really faithful.

:banghead:


glad to hear you have two healthy children.

[MrFrosty]

Originally posted by athee
as a "science/religion" sidenote, I went to engineering school with a catholic. I asked him about gawd/dinosaurs, and he said the fossils were placed there as a trick to see if we are really faithful.

That person deserves a pat on the head.

[Cipher Girl]

Hi fando

I live in the Antelope Valley north of LA and am an astromomy buff as well. Me and the hubby like to take the telescope and go up to Grandview campground at the Bristlecone Pine Forest north off of Hwy 395 at least a couple of time a year. What a great view, the campground is at 8500 feet in the White Mountains (very dry stable air). It seems to be a popular destination for amateur astromomers.

One time we went, about 5 years ago. In the spot next to ours was a family who had never camped there before. They thought everyone was weird because we all stayed up at night and noone wanted any lights on at night. ;) They had two sons and a daughter who were very curious about astronomy. I showed them Venus and some globular clusters. As usual with kids they started asking questions and I started answering. I don't remember exactly what answer upset the parents (something to do with various distances and the age of the universe).

But the couple suddenly said that they did not want their children to learn such lies, and it was time for them to go. What dimwits. Just because they want to bury themselves in a bunch of two thousand year old legends, they also did not want their children to learn any science at all. :(

I felt very sad for their kids, so much ignorance from the parents.

[Krosis]

Originally posted by athee
...as a "science/religion" sidenote, I went to engineering school with a catholic. I asked him about gawd/dinosaurs, and he said the fossils were placed there as a trick to see if we are really faithful...

arg...:banghead:

I dated a Pentacostal girl for a year once.. she held a similar view.

A few years ago my dad and I were making a day trip to the Field Museum in Chicago to see the opening of the new T-rex exhibit.. I asked her if she wanted to go along.. she told me flat out that she had no interest in going to see an exhibit put together by flawed human scientists out to make a buck with some animal bones cobbled together...

wow..

yeah.. we broke soon after. ;)

-cheers

[Asha'man]

Originally posted by fando
As an Astronomy buff, I sometimes share my telescope observations with random people that walk by.

I'm pretty active in my local astronomy club, including doing a number of sidewalk astronomy bits. I've got a bigger dob, so I get lots of people coming by, and sometimes hear the same type of stupid comments.

I've been looking for a good comeback, and think I may have found one. Since everything past 6,000 light years is an illusion (one of the YEC claims), then it's a deception. Satan is the deciever, so most of the galaxy (and all of the rest of the universe) is his work, not God's. So next time they peek at a galaxy or globular and thank God, I'm gonna correct them and thank Satan. :)

[Rhea]

Originally posted by Asha'man
Since everything past 6,000 light years is an illusion (one of the YEC claims), then it's a deception. Satan is the deciever, so most of the galaxy (and all of the rest of the universe) is his work, not God's. So next time they peek at a galaxy or globular and thank God, I'm gonna correct them and thank Satan. :)
:notworthy exquisite.

Neatly covers the whole "huh?" thing I feel when Christians tell me that their God is a deceiver.

[Kevin]

Another one which drives me nuts is when people say to me, when they realize I'm a musician and composer, "How can you not believe in God with your God-given talent?" I tell them that it's been years of hard work, and hours of practice each week with technical studies and etudes that gave me my talent. If God had anything to do with it, why was any of that studying and practice even necessary?

[Postcard73]

Hey KitKit, I can certainly understand getting frustrated by comments like that. I don't get frustrated; I just get a barely controllable urge to puke...
Originally posted by KitKit
"how can you see that sunset or look at your kids & not believe in god?" If I like the person who said it: "Actually, I think the fact that the universe doesn't have a creator, and that we are just insignificant specks in the universe, and that after several thousand years of human history we are still the only organisms we know of capable of enjoying the beauty of a sunset or our children, makes those things that much more amazing to behold."

If I don't like the person who said it: "I'm not a moron." But then, I have an unfortunate tendency to be blunt and confrontational...

[Jeffrey Formosa]

[edited threats of violence]

Please remember that advocating harm to others is not allowed on the IIDB.

Thank you,

Roland98
Secular Lifestyle Moderator

[MrFrosty]

Originally posted by Jeffrey Formosa
Edited for consistency

Advocating violence, even in jest, is usu. not tolerated in the forums here. I realise you made a thread about smart ppl with dumb mouths but exercising some restraint and a little thought in what you type will make your time here more pleasant.

[sullster]

I agree with you totally.

Years ago, I listened to an interview with Billy Graham on PBS. He knew where he was, so he was not being the usual bible thumper.

After the usual," jeebus changed everything for him",answers, he was asked how he first came to believe. Incredibly for me, Billy Graham actually said that the reason he first believed in god was because he looked at the stars and came to that conclusion.

Here is one of the biggest evangelical mouths of last half of the Twentieth Century and his personal basis for theism is a fuzzy feeling he got when he looked at stars one night!

That "look at the stars and believe in god" line is such nonsense to me. When I look at the stars I see lights coming from nuclear explosions millions of years old which are utterly meaningless to me personally. I sense no diety out there, or any evidence of one.

[Gawdawful]

Originally posted by sullster
Here is one of the biggest evangelical mouths of last half of the Twentieth Century and his personal basis for theism is a fuzzy feeling he got when he looked at stars one night! I saw a globular star cluster one night at a star party in Stansbury Park, Utah. I got a fuzzy feeling right then, chills almost, when I really conceptualized the vastness of space. The difference was I didn't attribute that fuzzy feeling to anything supernatural.


Warren

[fando]

Originally posted by Cipher Girl
Me and the hubby like to take the telescope and go up to Grandview campground at the Bristlecone Pine Forest north off of Hwy 395 at least a couple of time a year. What a great view, the campground is at 8500 feet in the White Mountains (very dry stable air). It seems to be a popular destination for amateur astromomers.


Oh hey, another spot to visit! Thanks! :D

My usual observing grounds are Mt. Wilson and Joshua Tree.

[King Rat]

"how can you see that sunset or look at your kids & not believe in god?"

Education.

[Cipher Girl]

Hi Fando

The Antelope Valley Astronomy Club has made several trips to use the 100 inch scope at Mt Wilson. But alas, I've not been able to go because of something always coming up. In fact, I've been unable to make the meetings the last 3 or 4 months due to work and school. :(

[Darwin26]

...seems there are a number of threads enduring this stigma that we live with ... 'dealing with believers'... Neighbor, elderly woman,a few doors down used to just say "Howdy Neighbor" and i'd hollar back "Howdy Neighbor" ...till she figured out that 'GODLESS' American bumper sticker ! Now, she Hollars "god bless you' ... what do ya say to them? i'm all over "which one" next time she can't help but break the silence...
...seems Xians always want to blame the Golden sunsets on god... But not the Earthquake ... Such a mental hopscotch they must endure ...
i most certainly agree with Cheesehead' It's not worth adjusting they're minds' and not a noble cause to be sure...

Let them fall on their own faces ...their fears seem so much greater than ours...

For you astromomers ... Can you show me What Comet Mr Applegate is on ?

[Dark Jedi]

Originally posted by Jmebob
I've always liked this one:

It's basically saying:

"I'm completely ignorant of the world around me so I'm going to believe in a giant voodoo monkey god that lives in the sky."

That is more or less my response.

"I see natural phenomenon easily understood with some basic knowledge, you see magic sky pixies. Who's the irrational one here?"

[AspenMama]

Originally posted by Dark Jedi
That is more or less my response.

"I see natural phenomenon easily understood with some basic knowledge, you see magic sky pixies. Who's the irrational one here?"
Do you say that to the Deacon? ;) You must like sleeping on the couch. :eek:

[fando]

Originally posted by Darwin26
For you astromomers ... Can you show me What Comet Mr Applegate is on ?

This (http://www.jpl.nasa.gov/images/comet/wild2-comet-browse.jpg) is a picture of comet Wild 2, taken by the Stardust (http://www.jpl.nasa.gov/releases/2004/1.cfm) probe. If you squint hard enough, you can see the face of G-d with his mouth agape.

[Darwin26]

Kewl Fando... and excuse me it's Applewhite .... Oie Vay ... and clearly the mouth of gawd is uttering something ... needs a caption for sure.... like "Noooaaahhhh!!!!" or "attention All subdieties form a line to the left ...demi-gawds on the right" a plausible natural phenomena circus under the universal big Top...

[tracer]

Hmmm ... the deep crater at the bottom kinda looks like Bugs Bunny's head. And the two oblong shallow craters above it are his ears.

Worship the bunny!

[AmbiguousUbiquity]

I used to have the same frustrated reaction, but I guess my old age of 25 has allowed me to become a little more mellow. When people ask this particular question of me, I just explain to them that when I look at the world around, I don't ever think, "Oh what a wonderful being god is to have made all this!!"

I always think, "Science is so amazing." I think it's because most of us who are atheist/agnostic have a better scientific understanding of what's going on around us. The more we learn and comprehend, the smaller the mystery of science is to us, and we're able to look at every day events, such as someone giving birth or a sunset, and are able to explain what's going on.

So what to say when people ask how we can NOT believe? Well, I always start to explain how the process of a sunset works, or the biology of cancer or the process of fertilization, and they always kind of zone out. Maybe it's over their heads?

[dimpledop]

Originally posted by KitKit
"how can you see that sunset or look at your kids & not believe in god?"
You could always ask "If that glorious sunset was created by a god, then what created that glorious god?" And if this god is too glorious (or mighty, or powerful...) to need a creator, then of course you could point out that the universe is also too glorious to need one, as well.

Originally posted by Darwin26
...till she figured out that 'GODLESS' American bumper sticker ! Now, she Hollars "god bless you' ... what do ya say to them?
You could try "Glory in atheism."

[Darwin26]

Ooooo nice shout to it, to "GLORY IN ATHEISM" !

[tracer]

Me feeling on the subject is that kids and sunsets look precious to us because our psychology has evolved to see them as beautiful. (Those people who see their kids as cute will be more likely to protect and provide for their kids than those people who see their kids as, say, rodents. The kids who are provided for and protected have a better chance of surviving to adulthood. And if there's a genetic basis for bonding with your kids, it'll be passed on to those kids. See?)

[Shake]

Originally posted by Darwin26
...seems Xians always want to blame the Golden sunsets on god... But not the Earthquake ... Such a mental hopscotch they must endure ... <quote about sunset and god>
"Yeah, how 'bout those 50,000 dead in Iran?" :rolleyes:

Oh wait, they're being punished for being Muslim! My bad. :p

[Abalone]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Darwin26
...seems Xians always want to blame the Golden sunsets on god... But not the Earthquake ...

Darwin26,

According to a fundie co-worker of mine back in '94, you folks weren't "livin' right" (her exact words) down there in the environs of Northridge. My response to her set off a huge argument, which caused her to make a formal complaint to the company that I wasn't respecting her religious beliefs.

There's actually a little ditty on the subject of divine retribution in the form of seismic disturbances, coined after the 1906 earthquake and fire in San Francisco. I hope I can remember it right:


If, as they say,
God 'spanked' the town
for being over-frisky

Why did He burn the churches down
and save Hotaling's Whiskey?


(Hotaling's Whiskey was a local distillery that survived the disaster, when almost everything else around it collapsed and/or burned.)