JP 2 scared of Spfld Mass?

[abe smith]

Hah hah: must be some kind of Vatican action record!
On Feb 11, faced w/ the local daily *Republican*'s questions to the local RC Bishop about accusations of his-own alleged sexual abuse of two teen-agers several decades previous,

(The accusers, now middle-aged men, had agreed to keep quiet, as a favor to him; when he was appointed Bishop here; but then when he joined the 4 Massachusetts Bishops's dirty pronouncements against gay marriage, the two accusers got ANGRY at his hypocrisy; and went public with their story.)

THOMAS DUPRE' the then Bishop of Springfield, Massachusetts immediately announced his resignation from the Bishoprick; "for health reasons"; and lammed outa town to a locked medical sanctuary in Maryland; and no-one's heard from him since...
Meanwhile the local District Attorney has announced that he's turning the allegations about Dupre over to a Grand Jury, to determine whether there's matter to bring civil charges (the first in the USA) against the now-ex-Bishop. And a few days ago, the local police (accompanied by some Federal agents? I may be incorrect about this latter fact.) went to the ex-Bishop's ex-living quarters with a search warrant; spent a couple of hours inside; and emerged with some boxes of big brown envelopes.

AND this morning's local *REPUBLICAN* page A-One top slot (beats the GLOBE for the scoop); announces that effective 11 March, a month to the day after Dupre''s resignation & flight, the Vatican has appointed a new Bishop of Springfield. Mass; a 66-y.o. Auxiliary of the New York Archdiocese.

The Pope's having acted THIS quickly, against all winter-treacled precedent, appears to indicate that John Paul 2 is running-scared about All-This (and of course the Massachusetts Legislature's upcoming vote for a Commonwealth Constitutional Amendment to outlaw same-sex marriage in Mass; altho of course even if they effect that now, it cannot become LAW until Nov 2006 at the very earliest; and cannot prevent the Massachusetts Supreme Judicial Court's order effecting same-sex marriage on 17th May upcoming.

Wow; exciting times to be living in Massachustts, Mother of the Free! I tell ya.

[Heurismus]

Thanks Abe, the pederast's name has been logged. Thanks once more. Heurismus.

[abe smith]

Not quite so fast, Dude; I tried to be very scrupulous about the LEGAL FACT that the "case" against ex-Bishop Dupre is not made yet; and that the ALLEGATIONS against him are just that: ALLEGATIONS. Altho the fact that the local daily has printed those, w/ the usual careful stipulations, seems to indicate that the processes are in process.

No charges have yet been brought against the ex=Bishop; certainly no charges have yet been proven against him; and of course, at present, ex-Bishop of springfield, Massachusetts Thomas L. Dupre' is LEGALLY INNOCENT of anything.

Just want to make these LEGAL FACTS perfectly clear. Thanks for your interest. Stay chuned.

[Heurismus]

Salute Abe, don't worry it is just that when he turns up to a dinner or somethimg, I know where to chuck up; in his soup!!!?
You haven't transgressed anyway, its me that knows how to sail a fine tuned yacht close to the wind. But I'm not the only one either, the bigger this gets and the longer it goes on, there is going to be serious trouble. That is why I have asked for moral decency from religious leaders. If they cannot provide it then before God and all of creation, it is they who are the corrupt, it is they who should be thrown from their station. If the man has an unblemished career, then I apologise, but I really don't know what for, nor would I retract on behalf of any victim. We must hear the voiceless and investigate their claims. Heurismus.

[Amos]

Originally posted by abe smith



The Pope's having acted THIS quickly, against all winter-treacled precedent, appears to indicate that John Paul 2 is running-scared about All-This


You don't think abe it is more like giving you the finger to spin on? (hint, he's done that before, you know). You seem to forget here that it is your Church in your country.

[Heurismus]

Derailing threads is a grave act of rational dialogue Amos!!!
The Roman religion befouls God's creation as surely as a rotting carcass poisons a well.

The Pope as head of the Roman Catholic curch is, by definition the father of the Church. He is responsible for the actions and activities of all those granted Holy orders and special dispensations.
We the people are obliged by Human laws, for "If we do not maintain Justice, Justice will not maintain us." (Francis Bacon) It is now necessary to break this farce of love and decency upon the wheel of reason. It is also time to prevent the hideous insurgency of an archaic mould which serves no man woman or child upon this earth; nor protects them from the evils within this crumbling edifice of the Roman Empire.
We shall now and forever more exert our efforts and our intellects to that end. I therefore appeal to all law abiding citizens to come forward and report the crimes of the Roman Catholic Church; be it physical abuse, mental abuse or fiduciary malpractice.
The grave of Catholicism is a short step away, and it not us who will lay that foetid corpse to rest, but the corruption of deception that lies at the core of this rotting stinking cadaver.
A new Catholicism must take hold; a revolution at the roots must pressure change; for it is the true believer that must rise up and create a new Catholic Church; one worthy of God's blessing.
Heurismus

[JP2]

I thought this thread was going to be about me for a second. I didn't even realize that my nick had such a papal connetation until now. :o

[abe smith]

1. Wow yu go, Heurismus! as for me, the sooner the roman catholic sect (sic) become extinct, the better.
2. And you, JP2, dear, 'd better get yrseff out of the target area (nick-name wise) before something unpleasant wd happen t'ya....

3.Meanwhile the real JP2 has now just appointed the FOUR (new) Bishops = ALL, >>,of Massachusetts. He has sent to us rural rubes of Western Massachusetts ( = Diocese of Springfield, MA) a 66 yr old Company Man/"Fixer" from the Archdiocese of NEW YORK, unquestionably commissioned to "Straighten-Out Those Silly Flits"; and of course to increase pressure on the Mass Legislature about/AGAINST same-sex marriage, etc blah blah blah. Lots of luck to you, John Paul 2; and to you, Timothy Ordinary-Designate.... Stay chuned. Our New Man is to be installed (forget the correct term...) here on April FIRST, the feast of All Fools. (Hey, hey Sire Asne, hey)

Assumption is strong that he intends to sweep everything back under the compost and fumigate the loudly-remaining STINK by waving his , uh, censer. We'll see.... I think he/They goina be surprised.

[Amos]

Originally posted by Heurismus
The Pope as head of the Roman Catholic curch is, by definition the father of the Church. He is responsible for the actions and activities of all those granted Holy orders and special dispensations.
//
A new Catholicism must take hold; a revolution at the roots must pressure change; for it is the true believer that must rise up and create a new Catholic Church; one worthy of God's blessing.
Heurismus

I like you ambition Heuri (I hope it's not born out of envy, lol) but the problem with a "new Catholicism" is that the key to its wisdom is divine inspiration and such is not for sale nor can it be duplicated (or we would not have to sell indulgences :confused: and the prots would be selling them instead of bibles).

No the Pope is not responsible for his subordinates because they are all citizens of their own respective countries and must abide to local laws as human beings bound by civil law. The Pope is "infallible" to say that he is above the law in that the supernatural is above the natural and because the supernatural is his domein through understanding he understands the natural for which civil law is a substitude because cave dwellers can't see the sun shine in their eyes nor can they tolerate its reflection on the celestial waters that surround them.

In this way the Church is in charge of God (we don't need Gods blessing; no arrogance here but just a necessary truth) and therefore in charge of the well being of the entire civilization that must obey and pay tribute to Ceasar first and only tithe to the will of Church. It is absurd, therefore, to even think that the Church should be responsible for their actions for that would be equal to extorting the monetary pledges that have been made in thanksgiving to the Church now on behalf of God.

I have seen kids picking the 'offer block' with a piece of wire but never thought that I would see the day that government officials would take the 'offer block' inculding the building that holds it (which must be just a stupid pile of bricks in their eyes).

You fail to recognize that the Church, while in charge of its own destiny, is a slave to Gods will on earth and even if the fires of hell would destroy the entire civilization it will never touch the saints in heaven who, as relaxed as ever, are just watching this great spectacle take place.

[Heurismus]

Dear Amos, I am a White Anglo-Scottish Atheist, not a White Anglo-Saxon Protestant as you seem to think.
Therefore any fight between Protestantism and Catholicism is of no direct interest to me. I was christened in St. Georges West, Edinburgh and I have a great affinity with Scotland, but I'm half English too, with a bit of Irish thrown in for good measure.
This is not about religious war for me, it is the tyranny of a religion which should have stopped fuelling the flames of world disaffection a long long time ago. It is corrupt to its very heart and has turned away from God's unity; it drives nails between the sexes and between families, it is the model upon which Mussolini, then Hitler based their model for world dominance. It's a shame that the Catholic empire is still trying to get back what was never theirs. If you want to be part of the world then you must be forced to kneel before the true God and ask forgiveness, otherwise there is no place for you...

http://www.landoverbaptist.org/sermons/catholics.html

[Amos]

But this is not a personal attack but at all but an argument based on what the Catholic church stands for. She cannot help her motives because she is a slave to this force of life that permeates Her entire being that stands as entity above the world as we know it.

In Catholicism truth is power and is never taken but comes our way like an ocean wave that can not be stopped even at our own will. Hitler may have been a Catholic until he became a "born again Catholic" when he was [also] 'from his mothers womb untimely ripped.' That was about the time we would have evaluated his condition and fed him to the storks to grant him his speedy afterlife, and forbidding this he became the tyrant we know his as today.